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From "Dakota Jack" <dakota.j...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: friday ha ha
Date Thu, 20 Apr 2006 04:33:42 GMT
You are just wrong about this, Alexandre.  Check out the archives before you
embarrass yourself.  However, as usual this is a non-starter.  This
discussion is as important as answer the other questions.  You just don't
understand how things work.

On 4/19/06, Alexandre Poitras <alexandre.poitras@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 4/19/06, Dave Newton <newton@pingsite.com> wrote:
> > Jonathan Revusky wrote:
> > > Dave Newton wrote:
> > >> If it _didn't_ make somebody shudder I'd seriously question their
> > >> overall programming knowledge... at some point you have to start
> over.
> > >
> > > Well, that's one assessment. OTOH, it is problematic to think that if
> > > somebody disagrees with you on this or something else that it calls
> > > into question their professional competence.
> >
> > Let's see...
> >
> > "[...] if somebody disagrees with you on this or something else [...]"
> >
> > You added the "or something else" part. I was addressing the idea that
> > refactoring Struts 1.x to the degree necessary to make it a "modern
> > solution" (the definition of which is yet another debate I shall not be
> > bothered with.)
> >
> > I stand by what I said: it's simply not worth the effort when other,
> > better [IMO] solution exist, and I would most certainly question the
> > knowledge of someone that disagreed with me. Would I _listen_ to why
> > s/he thinks it'd be worth it? For a little while, sure, until I made a
> > decision regarding their professional competence.
> >
> > I guess it's "taboo" to call people's professional competence into
> > question though.
> >
> > That's weird, 'cuz I do that almost every day. Heck, when I was more
> > directly involved in the hiring/firing/etc. I often did it several times
> > a day. When I was looking at resumes I'd question competence on a
> > line-by-line basis.
> >
> > > Again, I think my point stands: if there is no desire on the part of
> > > existing Struts committers to do anything with the Struts 1.x
> > > codebase, then there is really nothing to lose by letting other people
> > > who want to develop that come in and do something.
> >
> > Of course _you_ think your point stands, why else would you bother?
> >
> > (Well, I wonder why you'd bother anyway since you're not involved in the
> > web-app space, or Struts, but this seems to be a long-term ongoing issue
> > with you. It's okay little buddy; we've all got our issues.)
> >
> > The point _I_ made regarding willy-nilly commit rights also still
> > stands: I know _I_ wouldn't have time to review everybody's new code,
> > stability is important to me, so I don't _want_ just anybody to have
> > commit access.
> >
> > > If you say so... I am not quite sure what the basis of our
> > > disagreement on that was. And I have to point out that, okay, you can
> > > disagree with me, but it's hardly a symmetrical thing. I have actual
> > > experience running open source projects. You apparently do not.
> >
> > And? I guess that invalidates anything I have to say.
> >
> > You're not a politician (and, I suspect, have never been one) so I will
> > not listen to anything you have to say regarding the current Iraq
> > situation, which you inappropriately tried to use as an example saying
> > that just because you have an opinion on it doesn't mean you should have
> > to go over there and fix it. Obviously you going over there would not
> > fix that particular problem.
> >
> > Although it might fix several others.
> >
> > > But anyway, to focus on the question of our disagreement on this,
> > > let's take a specific case in point. I am not acquainted personally
> > > with Phil Zoio, the author of Strecks. It's not like I have some
> > > agenda of "championing his cause" or something like that; it's just a
> > > case in point to focus discussion. Now, it seems self-evident that
> > > this is a guy who is able and willing to do some quality work. Now, my
> > > view of things is that there is really no legitimate reason not to
> > > immediately make somebody like that a committer on the Struts project,
> > > if he wanted to do work on 1.x. (Again, if he or others want to do
> > > something with it and the existing committers don't...)
> > >
> > > Do you disagree with my view on this? If you do, what is the basis for
> > > your disagreement?
> >
> > Yes, I disagree.
> >
> > I don't know Phil, I haven't seen Strecks, haven't seen the code, etc.
> > so I have zero basis for saying he's "able and willing to do some
> > quality work." That's a show-stopper.
> >
> > "Oh, he has an open-source project that sounds and looks good, and he
> > wants to work." Those are not credentials. He might be the greatest
> > programmer ever, Strecks might be the bestest thing since sliced bread
> > (but it's not because it's not Lisp or SmallTalk, but whatever), and
> > maybe it _should_ be brought in. Awesome--but _I_ don't know that.
> >
> > So I would remain agnostic pending further information.
> >
> > I still don't know why you care so much about, and spend so much time
> > discussing, a project you're not interested in.
> >
>
> Maybe a big big big EGO :) Funny how Jonathan or Dakota are always so
> quick to anwser when it comes to the future of Struts or Apache but
> they don't answer any other questions on this list. I'm not better but
> I highly appreciate what Apache has done for me in the last couple of
> years and before critizing it so harshly I would try to participate a
> little bit more. Hey guys, you don't need any commit privileges to
> answer questions or make suggestions on this list by the way.
>
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
>
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>


--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~

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