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From Brian O'Neill <b...@alumni.brown.edu>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Pulling "Contrib" Modules into Apache
Date Wed, 26 Feb 2014 19:20:41 GMT
I¹ll pile on. (+1 to Robert¹s sentiments)

Taylor, just give the word and I can start to transition the IP for
storm-cassandra and storm-cassandra-cql.
I can also lend a hand supporting them.

-brian

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On 2/26/14, 1:43 PM, "Robert Lee" <lee.robert138@gmail.com> wrote:

>To build on Bobby's statement, it does pain me as a user to have to search
>outside of the project modules to find a compatible build that works with
>the latest version of storm as well as the latest module version. However,
>in instances such as hbase, cassandra, kafka, etc., I think these commonly
>used contrib projects should be pulled into storm if they meet stringent
>criteria of:
>
>1) Several volunteer developers familiar with code to update as new
>versions arise
>2) Fully implemented bolt/spout
>
>" If the build and test time starts to take too long, to me that means we
>need to start wondering if we have too many contrib modules." -- +1
>
>I would be willing to volunteer with the cassandra backing map module
>(especially with the latest CQL3 release).
>
>
>On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Bobby Evans <evans@yahoo-inc.com> wrote:
>
>> I can see a lot of value in having a distribution of storm that comes
>>with
>> batteries included, everything is tested together and you know it works.
>>  But I don't see much long term developer benefit in building them all
>> together.  If there is strong coupling between storm and these external
>> projects so that they break when storm changes then we need to
>>understand
>> the coupling and decide if we want to reduce that coupling by
>>stabilizing
>> APIs, improving version numbering and release process, etc.; or if the
>> functionality is something that should be offered as a base service in
>> storm.
>>
>> I can see politically the value of giving these other projects a home in
>> Apache, and making them sub-projects is the simplest route to that.  I'd
>> love to have storm on yarn inside Apache.  I just don't want to go
>> overboard with it.  There was a time when HBase was a "contrib" module
>> under Hadoop along with a lot of other things, and the Apache board came
>> and told Hadoop to brake it up.
>>
>> Bringing storm-kafka into storm does not sound like it will solve much
>> from a developer's perspective, because there is at least as much
>>coupling
>> with kafka as there is with storm.  I can see how it is a huge amount of
>> overhead and pain to set up a new project just for a few hundred lines
>>of
>> code, as such I am in favor of pulling in closely related projects,
>> especially those that are spouts and state implementations. I just want
>>to
>> be sure that we do it carefully, with a good reason, and with enough
>>people
>> who are familiar with the code to support it long term.
>>
>> If it starts to look like we are pulling in too many projects perhaps we
>> should look at something more like the bigtop project
>> https://bigtop.apache.org/ which produces a tested distribution of
>>Hadoop
>> with many different sub-projects included in it.
>>
>> I am also a bit concerned about these sub-projects becoming second class
>> citizens, where we break something, but because the build is off by
>>default
>> we don't know it.  I would prefer that they are built and tested by
>> default.  If the build and test time starts to take too long, to me that
>> means we need to start wondering if we have too many contrib modules.
>>
>> --Bobby
>>
>> From: Brian Enochson <brian.enochson@gmail.com<mailto:
>> brian.enochson@gmail.com>>
>> Reply-To: "user@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:
>> user@storm.incubator.apache.org>"
>><user@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:
>> user@storm.incubator.apache.org>>
>> Date: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 at 9:50 PM
>> To: "user@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:
>> user@storm.incubator.apache.org>"
>><user@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:
>> user@storm.incubator.apache.org>>
>> Cc: 
>>"dev@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:dev@storm.incubator.apache.org>"
>> <dev@storm.incubator.apache.org<mailto:dev@storm.incubator.apache.org>>
>> Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Pulling "Contrib" Modules into Apache
>>
>> hi,
>>    I am in agreement with Taylor and believe I understand his intent. An
>> incredible tool/framework/application like Storm is only enhanced and
>>gains
>> value from the number of well maintained and vetted modules that can be
>> used for integration and adding further functionality.
>>   I am relatively new to the Storm community but have spent quite some
>> time reviewing contributing modules out there, reviewing various
>>duplicates
>> and running into some version incompatibilities. I understand the need
>>to
>> keep Storm itself pure, but do think there needs to be some structure
>>and
>> governance added to the contributing modules. Look at the benefit a tool
>> like npm brings to the node community.
>>   I like the idea of sponsorship, vetting and a community vote.  I, as
>> sure many would be, am willing to offer support and time to working
>>through
>> how to set this up and helping with the implementation if it is decided
>>to
>> pursue some solution.
>>   I hope these views are taken in the sprit they are made, to make this
>> incredible system even better along with the surrounding eco-system.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Brian
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 9:36 PM, P. Taylor Goetz <ptgoetz@gmail.com
>> <mailto:ptgoetz@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> Just to be clear (and play a little Devil's advocate :) ), I'm not
>> suggesting that whatever a "contrib" project/module/subproject might
>>  become, be a clearinghouse for anything Storm-related.
>>
>> I see it as something that is well-vetted by the Storm community,
>>subject
>> to PPMC review, vote, etc. Entry would require community review, PPMC
>> review, and in some cases ASF IP clearance/legal review. Anything added
>> would require some level of commitment from the PPMC/committers to
>>provide
>> some level of support.
>>
>> In other words, nothing "willy-nilly".
>>
>> One option could be that any module added require (X > 0)  number of
>> committers to volunteer as "sponsor"s for the module, and commit to
>> maintaining it.
>>
>> That being said, I don't see storm-kafka being any different from
>>anything
>> else that provides integration points for Storm.
>>
>> -Taylor
>>
>>
>> On Feb 25, 2014, at 7:53 PM, Nathan Marz <nathan@nathanmarz.com<mailto:
>> nathan@nathanmarz.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I'm only +1 for pulling in storm-kafka and updating it. Other projects
>>put
>> these contrib modules in a "contrib" folder and keep them managed as
>> completely separate codebases. As it's not actually a "module" necessary
>> for Storm, there's an argument there for doing it that way rather than
>>via
>> the multi-module route.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Milinda Pathirage
>><mpathira@umail.iu.edu
>> <mailto:mpathira@umail.iu.edu>> wrote:
>> Hi Taylor,
>>
>> I'm +1 for pulling these external libraries into Apache codebase. This
>> will certainly benifit Strom community. I also like to contribute to
>> this process.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Milinda
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 5:28 PM, P. Taylor Goetz <ptgoetz@gmail.com
>> <mailto:ptgoetz@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> > A while back I opened STORM-206 [1] to capture ideas for pulling in
>> > "contrib" modules to the Apache codebase.
>> >
>> > In the past, we had the storm-contrib github project [2] which
>> subsequently
>> > got broken up into individual projects hosted on the stormprocessor
>> github
>> > group [3] and elsewhere.
>> >
>> > The problem with this approach is that in certain cases it led to code
>> rot
>> > (modules not being updated in step with Storm's API), fragmentation
>> > (multiple similar modules with the same name), and confusion.
>> >
>> > A good example of this is the storm-kafka module [4], since it is a
>> widely
>> > used component. Because storm-contrib wasn't being tagged in github, a
>> lot
>> > of users had trouble reconciling with which versions of storm it was
>> > compatible. Some users built off specific commit hashes, some forked,
>> and a
>> > few even pushed custom builds to repositories such as clojars. With
>>kafka
>> > 0.8 now available, there are two main storm-kafka projects, the
>>original
>> > (compatible with kafka 0.7) and an updated fork [5] (compatible with
>> kafka
>> > 0.8).
>> >
>> > My intention is not to find fault in any way, but rather to point out
>>the
>> > resulting pain, and work toward a better solution.
>> >
>> > I think it would be beneficial to the Storm user community to have
>> certain
>> > commonly used modules like storm-kafka brought into the Apache Storm
>> > project. Another benefit worth considering is the licensing/legal
>> oversight
>> > that the ASF provides, which is important to many users.
>> >
>> > If this is something we want to do, then the big question becomes what
>> sort
>> > governance process needs to be established to ensure that such things
>>are
>> > properly maintained.
>> >
>> > Some random thoughts, questions, etc. that jump to mind include:
>> >
>> > What to call these things: "contib modules", "connectors",
>>"integration
>> > modules", etc.?
>> > Build integration: I imagine they would be a multi-module submodule of
>> the
>> > main maven build. Probably turned off by default and enabled by a
>>maven
>> > profile.
>> > Governance: Have one or more committer volunteers responsible for
>> > maintenance, merging patches, etc.? Proposal process for pulling new
>> > modules?
>> >
>> >
>> > I look forward to hearing others' opinions.
>> >
>> > - Taylor
>> >
>> >
>> > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/STORM-206
>> > [2] https://github.com/nathanmarz/storm-contrib
>> > [3] https://github.com/stormprocessor
>> > [4] 
>>https://github.com/nathanmarz/storm-contrib/tree/master/storm-kafka
>> > [5] https://github.com/wurstmeister/storm-kafka-0.8-plus
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Milinda Pathirage
>>
>> PhD Student | Research Assistant
>> School of Informatics and Computing | Data to Insight Center
>> Indiana University
>>
>> twitter: milindalakmal
>> skype: milinda.pathirage
>> blog: http://milinda.pathirage.org<http://milinda.pathirage.org/>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Twitter: @nathanmarz
>> http://nathanmarz.com<http://nathanmarz.com/>
>>
>>
>>



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