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Message-ID: <48A0FA86.2090603@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2008 20:50:46 -0600
From: Martin Sebor <msebor@gmail.com>
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To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
Subject: Re: Website Layout
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Gav.... wrote:
> Hi Guys, back again,
> 
> It's been a while since March, moving to the other side of the continent and
> other stuff etc..
> 
> Anyway, I did some more to the Forrest site, for me to work a bit more
> freely I have put up a version at :-
> 
> http://people.apache.org/~gmcdonald/stdcxx/index.html

This looks fantastic!

> 
> I realise I may be a bit behind as some content will have changed, but if
> your happy with the layout etc, we can move on - that is of course you
> haven't decided on another route yet.

Other than a few minor updates I don't think we've made any
significant changes.

> 
> I'll continue on and get caught up on doc site content changes, then start
> activating links etc.

Let me know if there's I/we can do to help.

Martin

> 
> Gav...
> 
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Gav.... [mailto:brightoncomputers@brightontown.com.au]
>> Sent: Tuesday, 11 March 2008 11:25 PM
>> To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: Website Layout
>>
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Martin Sebor [mailto:sebor@roguewave.com]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2008 7:04 AM
>>> To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: Website Layout
>>>
>>> Gav.... wrote:
>>>> Hi Eric/All,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Eric Lemings [mailto:Eric.Lemings@roguewave.com]
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, 2 February 2008 2:17 AM
>>>>> To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
>>>>> Subject: RE: [jira] Assigned: (STDCXX-686) redesign web site
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I like it.  It follows the style of the current site so it's not
>>>>> too disruptive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Couple minor suggestions:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. Move the Documentation nav up to a tab next to the Download tab.
>>>> Yes, that can be done, no problem, I'll do that in my next patch if
>>>> no objections.
>>> Personally, I would probably try to tackle the migration of the
>>> site as it is to Forrest first so we can publish it as our default,
>>> and then work on improving the layout next. I don't know if this
>>> approach makes sense or it's less effort to restructure it at the
>>> same time.
>>>
>>>>> 2. Move all links at the top of the home page to the nav bar,
>>>>> and subdivide them into groups (e.g. General [Objectives, About],
>>>>> Project [Lists, Wiki, Status, News, Team], Technical (Bugs, Readme,
>>>>> License, Platforms, References]
>>>> Those links are auto generated from <sections> in the source and are
>>>> internal links to the relative section on that page. Dividing them
>>>> would mean creating new pages and moving content out of the home page
>>>> onto the new ones. This is no problem either, but its not my site, so
>>>> do you guys want to discuss the layout how you want it and I'll make
>>>> the changes ?
>>> Sure. We don't have any design document or a rationale for the
>>> current site but it makes sense to discuss it before Gav puts
>>> in a whole lot of time into it. Btw., how difficult is it to
>>> restructure the site in Forrest if we change our mind? :)
>> It's fairly easy, so no problem.
>>
>>> Here are some of my random thoughts on the subject...
>>>
>>> As far as tabs and menus go, I'd be inclined to follow the layout
>>> used by other projects. From what I see on the Forrest site, for
>>> instance, every tab is a menu with each menu item pointing to
>>> a separate page (although the Versioned Docs and Plugins tabs
>>> look like they're messed up). So if we expect each of Downloads
>>> and Documentation to break down into a number of menu items with
>>> a page for each, making them tabs sounds dandy.
>>>
>>> The one page I think is already way too long and that we should
>>> probably break up into a number of smaller ones is index.html
>>> (is there any kind of rule of thumb on how long the ideal page
>>> should be?) We should probably split it up into an About page
>>> (what is stdcxx), another one just for News, an another for
>>> our "mission statement" (current Objectives). I can see us also
>>> wanting to have a separate page or even a tab for Developers (as
>>> on the Forrest page), and split that one into a page (or more)
>>> for each of Committers, Contributors, and Users. And maybe also
>>> PMC. Then there is Communication and Mailing Lists which could
>>> be on the same page. I don't know how useful the References
>>> section is. Seems like keeping this on the Wiki might work
>>> better.
>> I attached a diff to the issue making a start along the lines above.
>> Once that's committed, I'll carry on and do some more.
>>
>>> Btw., I should mention that during the restructuring of the site
>>> I think it's important to preserve all existing links and ideally
>>> also major anchors so we don't break links pointing to our site.
>> If I do break any, I'll be sure to recheck and change them back where
>> possible.
>>
>> Incidently, I'll try and tackle the converting of the Class Reference
>> and User Guides last - there is a technique described at [1] , but lets
>> get everything else sorted first and happy, then I'll look at them.
>>
>> [1] -
>> http://forrest.apache.org/docs_0_90/howto/howto-custom-html-
>> source.html#cust
>> om
>>
>>
>>
>>> Martin
>>>
>>>>> 3. Where's the logo? :)
>>>> I'll fix that.
>> fixed.
>>
>> Gav...
>>
>>
>>>> Gav...
>>>>
>>>>> Brad.
>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Gav.... [mailto:brightoncomputers@brightontown.com.au]
>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 1:25 AM
>>>>>> To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
>>>>>> Subject: RE: [jira] Assigned: (STDCXX-686) redesign web site
>>>>>>
>>>>>> G'Day,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Martin Sebor [mailto:msebor@gmail.com] On Behalf Of
>>>>>> Martin Sebor
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, 1 February 2008 3:00 PM
>>>>>>> To: dev@stdcxx.apache.org
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [jira] Assigned: (STDCXX-686) redesign web site
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gav... wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi Martin,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Let me know what info you need from me next.
>>>>>>>> Once the source files I sent are in svn, then I'll be
>>>>>> able to patch
>>>>>>>> properly against that.
>>>>>>> It looks quite good, thanks! I published it in my home directory
>>>>>>> to get some feedback from others:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    http://people.apache.org/~sebor/stdcxx/forrest-site/
>>>>>> As initial information for others, the look of this site is the
>>>>>> standard issue 'forrest pelt theme' and if so wish, can be changed
>>>>>> to have more unique feel to it. This can wait I think until the
>>>>>> site is live and populated with docs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Btw., it looks like a couple of typos snuck into index.xml and
>>>>>>> bugs.xml. I corrected them to get forrest to generate the static
>>>>>>> site (otherwise it fails)...
>>>>>> Damn, sorry, I tested using 'forrest run' which ensures the
>>>>>> site is mostly
>>>>>> fine and working  - but does not scrutinise the xdocs for
>>>>>> validity against
>>>>>> the DTD. Only when a 'forrest site' or 'forrest
>>>>>> validate-xdocs' is run do
>>>>>> the files get checked against the DTD.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ... but I still get the error below at the
>>>>>>> end. It looks like a link is bad or something.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> * [6/30]    [0/0]     0.016s 1.5Kb   themes/getBlank.js
>>>>>>> X [0]                                     favicon.ico   BROKEN: No
>>>>>>> pipeline matched request: favicon.ico
>>>>>>>          at <map:mount> -
>>>>>>> file:/build/sebor/apache-forrest-0.8/main/webapp/./site
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Total time: 0 minutes 15 seconds,  Site size: 182,695 Site pages:
>> 42
>>>>>>> Java Result: 1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    Copying broken links file to site root.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Copying 1 file to /build/sebor/tmp/site2/build/site
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BUILD FAILED
>>>>>>> /build/sebor/apache-forrest-0.8/main/targets/site.xml:180: Error
>>>>>>> building site.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There appears to be a problem with your site build.
>>>>>> Easy one and my bad again. Automatically a favicon.ico is
>>>>>> associated with
>>>>>> the site and is in fact copied there when doing a 'forrest
>>>>>> seed-sample'.
>>>>>> As you found out though this produces many un-needed sample
>>>>>> files. So I
>>>>>> created the initial layout with a 'forrest seed-basic' which gives
>> you
>>>>>> a site structure but no files and in this case no favicon either.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So the cure is to stick a favicon.ico directly into the xdocs
>> folder.
>>>>>> The site will then build successfully.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The two typos are: a missing underscore in the section id
>>>>>>> mailing_list in index.xml and a stray # in bugs.xml. Forrest
>>>>>>> gives rather cryptic errors for them.
>>>>>> The error messages were mainly to do with why they did not
>>>>>> conform with the
>>>>>> DTD - i.e the # symbol is not allowed directly beneath <ol>
>>>>>> and points out
>>>>>> that only <li> can go inside.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most of the time, we will use Forrests v2.0 DTD -
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://forrest.apache.org/dtdx/document-v20.dtdx.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (it is working towards being more xhtml2 compliant)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So sounds like the next step is to commit the prototype into svn
>>>>>>> and set up a cron job to get it periodically published into some
>>>>>>> sandbox (such as my home directory) so we can work on the tables
>>>>>>> etc. Is that how you'd like to proceed?
>>>>>> Yep, fine by me, at least I'll be able to be useful with patches
>> then.
>>>>>> Once your happy with stability, completeness and the
>>>>>> forrestbot publishing
>>>>>> is working well, then it can be moved when your happy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm also curious if you have a suggestion for our documentation.
>>>>>>> Would it make sense to try to convert it as well or might some
>>>>>>> other solution be more appropriate?
>>>>>> I have referred this to the Forrest dev list. It should not
>>>>>> be a problem
>>>>>> in principle, convert the .html files into xdoc xml and then
>>>>>> back into .html
>>>>>> integrated into the rest of the generated site. Hopefully the
>> initial
>>>>>> conversion to xdoc can be automated. Once in xdoc xml format
>>>>>> then they can
>>>>>> be placed appropriately, added to the site.xml and tabs.xml
>>>>>> files and from
>>>>>> then on be part of the site proper.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I notice Jira replies are set to issues@, is there a Jira
>>>>>> ticket filed
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> change this to dev@.
>>>>>>> Not yet. I was hoping to get to it this week but lately time has
>>>>>>> a habit of getting away from me... You don't happen to know where
>>>>>>> to change this, do you?
>>>>>> I don't have the access to do it, I've asked on #infra and
>>>>>> will let you know
>>>>>> if someone does it. Otherwise you need to send a mail to
>>>>>> apmail@ and file a
>>>>>> Jira Issue on infra for it to be done .
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (http://apache.org/dev/reporting-issues.html#mail-config)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gav...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Martin
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Gav...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <quote who="Martin Sebor (JIRA)">
>>>>>>>>>      [
>>>>>>>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/STDCXX-
>>>>>> 686?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-
>> tabpanel
>>>>>>>>> ]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Martin Sebor reassigned STDCXX-686:
>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>     Assignee: Martin Sebor
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> redesign web site
>>>>>>>>>> -----------------
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                 Key: STDCXX-686
>>>>>>>>>>                 URL:
>>>>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/STDCXX-686
>>>>>>>>>>             Project: C++ Standard Library
>>>>>>>>>>          Issue Type: Improvement
>>>>>>>>>>          Components: Web
>>>>>>>>>>            Reporter: Martin Sebor
>>>>>>>>>>            Assignee: Martin Sebor
>>>>>>>>>>         Attachments: Copy of stdcxx.zip
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>   Original Estimate: 16h
>>>>>>>>>>  Remaining Estimate: 16h
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The current web site is a bunch of static HTML pages
>>>>>> with a lot of
>>>>>>>>>> difficult-to-maintain formatting cruft copied from
>>>>>> pages of another
>>>>>>>>>> incubator project. We should look into generating the site from
>>>>>>>>>> easier-to-maintain "sources" using a tool like Apache
>>>>>> Forrest or some
>>>>>>>>>> such.
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> This message is automatically generated by JIRA.
>>>>>>>>> -
>>>>>>>>> You can reply to this email to add a comment to the issue online.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
>>>>>>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>>>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.2 - Release Date:
>>>>>> 1/12/2008
>>>>>>> 12:00 AM
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
>>>>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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>>>>> 12:00 AM
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.2/1221 - Release Date:
>> 1/12/2008
>>> 2:04 PM
>>
>> --
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG.
>> Version: 7.5.518 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1323 - Release Date: 3/10/2008
>> 11:07 AM
> 
>