From dev-return-7679-archive-asf-public=cust-asf.ponee.io@mxnet.incubator.apache.org Fri Jun 12 22:39:59 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [207.244.88.153]) by mx-eu-01.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id 54B481804BB for ; Sat, 13 Jun 2020 00:39:59 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 62842 invoked by uid 500); 12 Jun 2020 22:39:58 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@mxnet.incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: dev@mxnet.incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list dev@mxnet.incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 62826 invoked by uid 99); 12 Jun 2020 22:39:58 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd2-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 22:39:58 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd2-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd2-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id A52101A31FD for ; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 22:39:57 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd2-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.001 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=disabled Authentication-Results: spamd2-us-west.apache.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mx1-he-de.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd2-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.9]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X3esexdXlO2w for ; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 22:39:55 +0000 (UTC) Received-SPF: Pass (mailfrom) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::741; helo=mail-qk1-x741.google.com; envelope-from=marco.g.abreu@gmail.com; receiver= Received: from mail-qk1-x741.google.com (mail-qk1-x741.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::741]) by mx1-he-de.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-he-de.apache.org) with ESMTPS id E6D2A7E14C for ; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 22:39:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qk1-x741.google.com with SMTP id q8so10536133qkm.12 for ; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 15:39:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rABxTA3Qb8MlFSNk0IZOjuShm8RNwRg2xAJykdnTNSQ=; b=GBw2MlAeJQWa4O+Fw4Mf0DvCxDse+J66HTYhfNrJB2dvvAEm0QhifeaSBKwuB/sb0F w6wUGZviEQkTYHT2zfECu1PXoMXoaxp45r5GTKjcIYOG2mXLk3x/x+D2KVhV8iyL5cXP YnF2aKK9oiu5g5vOmV57wP1se6x1hxeVolgwkYqwuPHjBYAzghMyG6xF0d4IYrD1+Zn2 kqhinoxV4BCDvUINt4h4Ir2Kk161xEKw/1ohcgkX+BYTnEMpEggIAQwr1lu1jpauWsPf IubJoZK1OmIC7awN1Ezd6YQyKKMsT/QsJde+Frb0EoJhhzvEGV8vQICm8HVXNncCh87x DiAA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=rABxTA3Qb8MlFSNk0IZOjuShm8RNwRg2xAJykdnTNSQ=; b=o0OzDiIxPdhvOQfwkQo6oIupsAZZg1y+TIUndlb6EK1KMd0pxT3FcDVjc/DsItX7yl n2R/GXo6b6I3E/60LqYpyF79e+vqQGI65IXqUG5Nre+y+GW9TZlDGpsGseFikNlJ5fAe 9E+FQvOUwuZQ12aHRa6I5MK42wQ6zB0xlpWsTC/uUeLQ/JhDcn470uclUCRhwkLtvYV1 va13CmaMJhEE9+8EsY/PfiGSY44XvLQ2ENvZI8jmook5WY0rKv8bz9ydXdXESdFGR1n8 ThjhoLRPtY/2jcyo/E+JBEhYDJnrBU6eHz4XoN41g0vqEOiAeOXeBYOwlVtMgla1wzJn DISQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531IJTXO8z586qBpmEDhhjCbrRKxbZ5mv3hINX09jZQ2F+WYXBYh 8V9FO9d+evd8f1mFYENHxGdgWLm9LZ4NiqyfeKqZ+xpZnWM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwErGhxQL356eRgxKdue8QZJPXM7/5WewHZmFIpe6DbeMp0NmIrNlF4EJ/If0htAIXc7MeK8cvVTv9tTm9R2w0= X-Received: by 2002:a37:9a06:: with SMTP id c6mr5455680qke.33.1592001587802; Fri, 12 Jun 2020 15:39:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Marco de Abreu Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2020 00:39:10 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Ownership of discuss.mxnet.io To: dev@mxnet.incubator.apache.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000001f780905a7eac1aa" --0000000000001f780905a7eac1aa Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Thanks for elaborating! You are right, there's no requirement to host on ASF infrastructure. I was just thinking about what happens when that funding is cut or when there's an issue. What's the strategy to ensure no data loss in case of priority shift or defunding from Amazon? Opposed to the CI which is fully codified and under version control, we as PMC have no means to recover from a disaster in case of Discourse. The mxnet.io domain is not under control of the ASF. If we say that a user facing platform is managed and endorsed by the PPMC, we should make it available under the ASF domain system to further represent the official affiliation. Also, it removes a weak link in the chain - e.g. the case when the mxnet.io domain ran out and broke quite a bit of stuff. Since the ASF offers subdomains for projects, I don't see any reason why not to use them. Could you open a ticket with INFRA to check what authentication options they are offering? I couldn't find any info on the website. -Marco On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 12:24 AM Sheng Zha wrote: > > Could you elaborate about the hosting of the forum? Is there the > > possibility to move it to some ASF-managed webhost (I'm not sure about > the > > complexity of hosting Discourse)? > > The website is currently a subscribed hosted service provided by > discourse, donated by Amazon. It is possible to host it ourselves but it > would incur additional operational cost. In addition, I'm not aware of a > requirement to have it on ASF infrastructure, given that it's only for > answering user questions and we don't conduct official Apache MXNet > businesses there. > > > Also, I'd suggest to make an Apache managed subdomain the main domain > (e.g. > > https://discuss.mxnet.apache.org/ ). The > > existing domain could be a redirect. > > I don't see a benefit of doing that, nor am I aware of a requirement for > it. > > > Additionally, can we hook it up to the Apache IDP to allow committers and > > pmc members to be automatically authorized? > > This sounds like a good idea though I'm not sure how to proceed. If > someone knows how to proceed I'm happy to help grant necessary access to it. > > -sz > > > On 2020/06/12 22:07:47, Marco de Abreu wrote: > > Hi Sheng, > > > > thanks for the quick response. > > > > Could you elaborate about the hosting of the forum? Is there the > > possibility to move it to some ASF-managed webhost (I'm not sure about > the > > complexity of hosting Discourse)? > > > > Also, I'd suggest to make an Apache managed subdomain the main domain > (e.g. > > https://discuss.mxnet.apache.org/ ). The > > existing domain could be a redirect. > > > > Additionally, can we hook it up to the Apache IDP to allow committers and > > pmc members to be automatically authorized? > > > > Best regards > > Marco > > > > On Fri, Jun 12, 2020 at 11:24 PM Sheng Zha wrote: > > > > > Hi Marco, > > > > > > I'm an admin of that website along with a couple of other PPMC members. > > > This forum has been around for some time and has been helpful in > connecting > > > users of mxnet to the developer community. I think it's in the best > > > interest of this community to consider this under PPMC control for > better > > > discoverability under the mxnet domain name. I'm happy to grant you > admin > > > access if you or any other PPMC members need it. If you feel otherwise, > > > feel free to propose how you suggest we proceed. > > > > > > -sz > > > > > > On 2020/06/12 21:07:28, Marco de Abreu wrote: > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > > > Due to a PR [1] I had a closer look at discuss.mxnet.io which is a > > > forum to > > > > discuss about MXNet. It's a very helpful platform and provides great > > > > assistance for the community. > > > > > > > > When I looked into the terms of services [2] though, I noticed that > the > > > ASF > > > > and MXNet ppmc are mentioned as owners. > > > > > > > > From my understanding, that forum and the domain are not managed by > the > > > ASF > > > > or the mxnet ppmc. Thus, that statement does not seem correct and is > > > rather > > > > a trademark infringement. My understanding is that the platform is > > > operated > > > > by a third party as a community service towards MXNet. Thus, I think > it's > > > > important to properly express who's responsible for that platform. > > > > > > > > If somebody has any knowledge about the owner of that forum, I'd > > > appreciate > > > > if they could give them a heads up for this thread. > > > > > > > > Best regards > > > > Marco > > > > > > > > [1]: https://github.com/apache/incubator-mxnet/pull/18553/files > > > > [2]: https://discuss.mxnet.io/tos > > > > > > > > > > --0000000000001f780905a7eac1aa--