Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public-internal@cust-asf2.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public-internal@cust-asf2.ponee.io Received: from cust-asf.ponee.io (cust-asf.ponee.io [163.172.22.183]) by cust-asf2.ponee.io (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CAA6200C44 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 16:27:04 +0200 (CEST) Received: by cust-asf.ponee.io (Postfix) id 7B569160B85; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:27:04 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by cust-asf.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id 985F4160B5D for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 16:27:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 21448 invoked by uid 500); 27 Mar 2017 14:27:02 -0000 Mailing-List: contact users-help@groovy.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: users@groovy.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list users@groovy.apache.org Received: (qmail 21438 invoked by uid 99); 27 Mar 2017 14:27:02 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd4-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:27:02 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd4-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd4-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id E2EF3C0D5B for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:27:01 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd4-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.879 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.879 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=disabled Authentication-Results: spamd4-us-west.apache.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mx1-lw-us.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd4-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.11]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zFr1tiaoJ28S for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:27:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-lf0-f50.google.com (mail-lf0-f50.google.com [209.85.215.50]) by mx1-lw-us.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-us.apache.org) with ESMTPS id 886A45FACC for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:26:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf0-f50.google.com with SMTP id x137so22699585lff.3 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 07:26:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=VV5+qgjFoMmMd1Su6WmijjL5DL7HlvBq+d9ALE3lmEg=; b=CCi7DGeNIGb2f5qOmvdnu8xMAMFg0V/2jvMxGgy8HEm8JfNbms53bSW+gOiaItCAFo WCwFjxj+zsbNBlYCYQWmU0bC4u27FNK93Ie7EVH1H+R/U41pqFSBjd5q2bE6yCy3quaA nNgPI2zsPASYl2PHkMmApxgygzRwL+CK/6UIhhFxzH7svcUkBLBHyBxjo96oxtB2I3vo 8ICrMqLvz6U/SkwpOzan1oNtAon5UX6GDbzMVHdJYLaCS5JOX2+raNp/H3ceju08mMVf ycge0tlhPBc4QrySahHX34tu0jettIxpjM13HqniGuPxsXm5ZRqI0DymTSTt/sne3en1 DLPw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=VV5+qgjFoMmMd1Su6WmijjL5DL7HlvBq+d9ALE3lmEg=; b=q6lLNZc0EJoGinyW+rthGuTZUvOg1Bvc2jhhvwAdJKqnUQrdZjvHcle4Kpo6guiNYs vpqS+/zjN8HIBgfCUhfPPuRrs7y5XcYEYDDJ9JQo3c4UCqHKZRP/e0b+o+QgWIcYOcIZ vzXUjjneybRrjxzuClfVV6MqdoLjrjQmkYRAF/zSlANbPjmG7jKiWtbMEz4qD6r1Uwan QT/rLJ5n+/NS9PbIyYPnQbgEPPwiroTqYS/MHSJodUQsWAf7VMBjfBA9H/iDiNcaQp1E pCQOj0B8eAFGiRXtBo6JtV1SYqJxomZfRfnBBIpoPNEfDCk3CcQRiyTQvRrYXleRe7px s5pw== X-Gm-Message-State: AFeK/H0hUFQUSNkRlUXf529tj3BVEk9nTsHngcaCfeu7Y6S1H2ghwM36UYx7RZozejeq5YgN62uYxc4hCjd/fA== X-Received: by 10.25.93.86 with SMTP id p22mr11058577lfj.9.1490624818241; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 07:26:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.25.16.28 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Mar 2017 07:26:57 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <1490424776.8008.7.camel@winder.org.uk> <58D629B1.6040504@gmx.org> <1490621759.19826.15.camel@winder.org.uk> From: Andres Almiray Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2017 16:26:57 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Groovy and JVM version [was Testing the Java 8 / Parrot parser online!] To: users@groovy.apache.org Cc: Paul King Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f403045e315ec8e8cf054bb72206 archived-at: Mon, 27 Mar 2017 14:27:04 -0000 --f403045e315ec8e8cf054bb72206 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Measure, don't guess! ;-) Perhaps setting up a set of JMH benchmarks would help? I know there's a Gradle plugin for it (wink wink, nudge nudge). ------------------------------------------- Java Champion; Groovy Enthusiast http://andresalmiray.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/aalmiray -- What goes up, must come down. Ask any system administrator. There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't. To understand recursion, we must first understand recursion. On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 4:13 PM, C=C3=A9dric Champeau wrote: > I would only make indy the default if we have performance tests showing > that it's as fast as, or better than the legacy call site caching, with J= DK > 8+. There's a "performance" submodule that we could use for that purpose > too. As far as I remember, not too far away, there were quite a few cases > where indy was slower, in particular when primitive types are involved, > even on JDK 8. If we are faster, then it's obviously a big +1, but we > shouldn't speculate here. > > 2017-03-27 16:03 GMT+02:00 Paul King : > >> Russel, seems we were thinking about the same things. I responded to >> the earlier thread. Does that answer your question? >> In summary, we could start trying to move to indy only on master. I >> think stability wise we are in good shape. There are some question >> marks still however about indy performance in some circumstances, so >> we no doubt would want to do a fresh round of performance checks. >> >> Cheers, Paul. >> >> On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 11:35 PM, Russel Winder >> wrote: >> > On Sat, 2017-03-25 at 09:26 +0100, Jochen Theodorou wrote: >> >> [=E2=80=A6] >> >> >> >> I cannot suggest to users to use indy with a normal JDK7, so the >> >> minimum >> >> requirement for it is JDK8. And we are not there yet. >> > >> > I have to admit I am still of the opinion that you define a version >> > that will be the last version compatible with infrastructure X and the >> > say, if you want to use a later version upgrade your infrastructure. I >> > think Groovy is past that point with JVM; I do not see why development >> > of our product should be beholden to the inability of people to upgrad= e >> > from Java 7 to Java 8. >> > >> > Are we going to say that Groovy 2.5 will only work with JDK8 or does >> > that have to wait for 2.6 or 3.0? Given master is no beyond 2.5 can we >> > get rid of the two build set up for master and just have indy? >> > >> > -- >> > Russel. >> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> > Dr Russel Winder t: +44 20 7585 2200 <+44%2020%207585%202200> >> voip: sip:russel.winder@ekiga.net >> > 41 Buckmaster Road m: +44 7770 465 077 xmpp: russel@winder.org.uk >> > London SW11 1EN, UK w: www.russel.org.uk skype: russel_winder >> > > --f403045e315ec8e8cf054bb72206 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Measure, don't guess! ;-)

Perhaps se= tting up a set of JMH benchmarks would help? I know there's a Gradle pl= ugin for it (wink wink, nudge nudge).
<= br clear=3D"all">
----------------------------------------= ---
Java Champion; Groovy Enthusiast
http://andresalmiray.com
http://www.linkedin.com/in/aa= lmiray
--
What goes up, must come down. Ask any system administra= tor.
There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand bin= ary, and those who don't.
To understand recursion, we must first und= erstand recursion.

On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 4:13 PM, C=C3=A9dric= Champeau <cedric.champeau@gmail.com> wrote:
I would only make indy the defa= ult if we have performance tests showing that it's as fast as, or bette= r than the legacy call site caching, with JDK 8+. There's a "perfo= rmance" submodule that we could use for that purpose too. As far as I = remember, not too far away, there were quite a few cases where indy was slo= wer, in particular when primitive types are involved, even on JDK 8. If we = are faster, then it's obviously a big +1, but we shouldn't speculat= e here.

2017-03-27 16:03 GMT+02:00 Paul King <paulk@asert.com.au>:
Russe= l, seems we were thinking about the same things. I responded to
the earlier thread. Does that answer your question?
In summary, we could start trying to move to indy only on master. I
think stability wise we are in good shape. There are some question
marks still however about indy performance in some circumstances, so
we no doubt would want to do a fresh round of performance checks.

Cheers, Paul.

On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 11:35 PM, Russel Winder <russel@winder.org.uk> wrote:
> On Sat, 2017-03-25 at 09:26 +0100, Jochen Theodorou wrote:
>> [=E2=80=A6]
>>
>> I cannot suggest to users to use indy with a normal JDK7, so the >> minimum
>> requirement for it is JDK8. And we are not there yet.
>
> I have to admit I am still of the opinion that you define a version > that will be the last version compatible with infrastructure X and the=
> say, if you want to use a later version upgrade your infrastructure. I=
> think Groovy is past that point with JVM; I do not see why development=
> of our product should be beholden to the inability of people to upgrad= e
> from Java 7 to Java 8.
>
> Are we going to say that Groovy 2.5 will only work with JDK8 or does > that have to wait for 2.6 or 3.0? Given master is no beyond 2.5 can we=
> get rid of the two build set up for master and just have indy?
>
> --
> Russel.
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> Dr Russel Winder=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 t: +44 20 7585 2200=C2= =A0 =C2=A0voip: sip:russel.winder@ekiga.net
> 41 Buckmaster Road=C2=A0 =C2=A0 m: +44 7770 465 077=C2=A0 = =C2=A0xmpp: russe= l@winder.org.uk
> London SW11 1EN, UK=C2=A0 =C2=A0w: www.russel.org.uk=C2=A0 skype: r= ussel_winder


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