From dev-return-100118-archive-asf-public=cust-asf.ponee.io@geronimo.apache.org Sun May 5 16:45:10 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [207.244.88.153]) by mx-eu-01.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id AE3D218066B for ; Sun, 5 May 2019 18:45:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 8656 invoked by uid 500); 5 May 2019 16:45:09 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@geronimo.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk list-help: list-unsubscribe: List-Post: Reply-To: dev@geronimo.apache.org List-Id: Delivered-To: mailing list dev@geronimo.apache.org Received: (qmail 8644 invoked by uid 99); 5 May 2019 16:45:08 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd1-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 05 May 2019 16:45:08 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd1-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd1-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 3A922C06ED for ; Sun, 5 May 2019 16:45:08 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd1-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.201 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=disabled Authentication-Results: spamd1-us-west.apache.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=yahoo.de Received: from mx1-lw-eu.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd1-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.7]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eaS1hkpKBxjJ for ; Sun, 5 May 2019 16:45:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from sonic303-20.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic303-20.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.178.201]) by mx1-lw-eu.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-eu.apache.org) with ESMTPS id D627D5F19C for ; Sun, 5 May 2019 16:45:04 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.de; s=s2048; t=1557074704; bh=qmgjE3vDg5jfmQG+1RfikGw8HXD4VKB3Xr16L+EGiAY=; h=From:Subject:Date:References:To:In-Reply-To:From:Subject; b=NA21Y3R6Pc3K63Aj3a7XWqoy3oOC8XIPeO4Tux9cJb9cn0tK9AOXMMVCX8XhQ2To/PpQW3yoYfJigi0seubfN33rOQcSF9QSbKZEmNtoJSZumZd5D3J5hkWxy9kk19Vx5bPOX4TskSE4ATqqJNbL2J13J8Myj5JuRwHh9iKa/qmC1KAZrsgr0iG6F9eBUEEEwe8XR36jeBurClb2FQJwIO0Bikp9maxplNfxd9gaLbhFNt3BM/+Ct59vWkkai7OpN/HIsJ/uLZ8QECGcb34Wwc6w3/ZhKtTxTv5oFuQKnaf/AkLbjK2fgT3spVLNbMviVhtzTd05CUEcwjfzHfb9wA== X-YMail-OSG: Owt9NJwVM1keosC6kfdYu0fwlZMlxLHa_pLwu8kFa4nfxQRMKietZxzyOMiFbgT vOB_kmMD40GZmKw10Zy4WM3AtJ1ljDaG6TbWnIZA7wOUbdebAHUABV3w5IxaZTGgNPZAYkwJwoQj JfdvS3iEZ37DZ.8jb1QvXkhMNPY60x2J6bl9sTQv.38HshNuj_QmD2lq_qmrgnj.54I54f466hPt Z.6h3Zd207fiTG1ahb1tSwPew.x4W.WAPtlY54zmvv.f8ltgpaY8frVYy96xma_DU8AKTqmMMLIP Tskprm7khY8BnlGL1Oe_xCr2qir6YDA4BP3QpZbTF.b3ef2jIhxM3faESAX2L70DMsmrfBXTSl3a eIMLXGBjVGdJwZAi.__10Es8D80UaQPJfDotKNY602NwxB65S3oxpZLLZ7uMQwnvVP8.ddOAu8By VmqQSFE8ZyPZXnlo6orbWjna8jKoDkEFJc3OrxePTxJxPMAk6uKhunufhcTD.9jEaNpeUMgNiNv6 ejSHkBWMmG9N0HFqROML3BtCdKMBkQH3pPG9q9AZu9QF4hDj59RkwmvhPOV4IuzUPZBdjLQtm0wU dLvpt12PANR1AWUfj.NWH2aJkjwxOvWQpISEodd8tOVZUgAlR0YMC_kk353ciarVJrhmSJtzHVNs QumVu42uNOwPcPSQS4ygIJJJRPB6KeVFw5g5ZRWGj8SN0XZ8oDq3XsP9mAVpRjU7GD97pKFDyGi7 uzP1bAVY6Syb3HVgej5rL74BeojYRkn3BWNgG7mHyZ3B3MGyXeYDBdbfBfXrjAeYJ6DhkJeow3Kh LmU86tncTGjESuXKbdBAXwJL2yUd33ygvs1h_V1GyvhXp8NKkSHsc815mbVC6BC3_Mr_LL9_Isym aJ0_Z9HHG1FDuaMihtEfJ1TFmy.l98_PRrwywL1U8cJJfvUQAhaHbhNxP0rhRFcMVeBfhlHkuCx9 h8BFvYeIvm1giPpDK.tJmXMLvjTTSI2SnrD9tMYpogj5dFXrvrYf5OIqz4iDlz_yA8rNw_yxLZV5 j0U16kCrtY9NmRBzKW3BjJnZcLj2d_ch3R4DfRSU3HlCY9s2IEm0T9vfZqB9tIaaTZmObd5RxpAZ vEMQ0_5m2aXNHm1V0MCPVjV43.5KlKlPSeXKTFXh5jbo5rE58nQ-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic303.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 5 May 2019 16:45:04 +0000 Received: from 84-113-114-132.cable.dynamic.surfer.at (EHLO strubelix.lan) ([84.113.114.132]) by smtp405.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID e36d2bf7bef62c1e27f09e3c928a4d61 for ; Sun, 05 May 2019 16:45:01 +0000 (UTC) From: Mark Struberg Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] implement jakarta spec apis Date: Sun, 5 May 2019 18:45:00 +0200 References: <89C25331-028B-4C1E-84C7-60741C515953@yahoo.de> <9EAABA10-ECB6-4053-B7FD-8C901D9E3553@yahoo.de> <68371188-8355-4E6C-A63D-F791044ACDA5@yahoo.de> <9904D65B-AA35-4037-95C3-3CDF83F18F98@yahoo.de> <9E67C623-78BE-4FE8-9FD7-D0BE2CF7C608@yahoo.de> <9EEF5150-758D-4F61-B586-78229BFC4BB3@yahoo.de> To: geronimo-dev In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) I'm not even sure whether they yet got all the necessary IP to release = anything. LieGrue, strub > Am 05.05.2019 um 18:39 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = : >=20 >=20 >=20 > Le dim. 5 mai 2019 =C3=A0 18:30, Mark Struberg a = =C3=A9crit : > I'm not mandating jakarta in the groupId, but it should something else = than the current one. > Because otw we would have them completely mixed up in the same folder. = That's not nice. >=20 > Depends, that said happy to just replace specs by jakarta if it works = for you better (org.apache.geronimo.jakarta). I just dont want = jakarta-specs or _spec-xxx as before, always looked fishy and almost = wrong even if I get where it comes from. >=20 > Btw, what is our status on having eclipse releasing api under asf2 = license? >=20 > I dont want us to invest in something we drop like in 2 weeks and = sounds it can be for most of specs. Any page tracking that? >=20 >=20 > LieGrue > strub >=20 > > Am 05.05.2019 um 18:20 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = : > >=20 > > We dont need jakarta in the gav at all. > >=20 > > Why not org.apache.geronimo.spec:servlet:4.0.1? > >=20 > > As a reminder specs means jakarta already and there id jo ambiguity = between jakarta and javaee thanks the version.=20 > >=20 > > That said if we move to git it id even physically clearer. > >=20 > > Finally servlet is a bad example cause owned at tomcat for apache i = think. We should absolutely stop duplicating them, it pollutes user land = for no gain IMHO. > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > Le dim. 5 mai 2019 =C3=A0 16:28, Mark Struberg a = =C3=A9crit : > > Eclipse itself probably doesn't yet have all the IP themselves. This = first needs to be clarified. Since all those legal questions have been = dealt with behind closed doors we simply have no idea. > >=20 > > But we do have clean-room implemented APIs under ALv2 over here at = Geronimo. > > And we can move this ourselves without having to wait for anybody. > >=20 > > LieGrue, > > strub > >=20 > >=20 > > > Am 05.05.2019 um 16:12 schrieb Bernd Eckenfels = : > > >=20 > > > I wonder if you need that going forward for Jakarta Specs, they = could just be distributed by Eclipse directly? Having said that, if this = is not the case I would at least remove =E2=80=9Egeronimo-=E2=80=9C from = the artifact Id? > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > -- > > > http://bernd.eckenfels.net > > > =20 > > > Von: Mark Struberg > > > Gesendet: Sonntag, Mai 5, 2019 4:09 PM > > > An: geronimo-dev > > > Betreff: Re: [DISCUSS] implement jakarta spec apis > > > =20 > > > For now I've used the following patterns:=20 > > >=20 > > > org.apache.geronimo.jakarta-specs=20 > > > because specs and jakarta-specs should be in a clearly separated = folder.=20 > > >=20 > > > geronimo-jakarta-servlet_spec=20 > > > because 'jakarta' should be in the jar name=20 > > >=20 > > > 4.0_1-SNAPSHOT=20 > > > 4.0 is for servlet-4.0, 1 is the patch level.=20 > > >=20 > > > I'd NOT do a release or push to our snapshots repo until in about = 2 weeks when the modus operandi is clear within the Jakarta community.=20= > > >=20 > > > LieGrue,=20 > > > strub=20 > > >=20 > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > > Am 05.05.2019 um 08:55 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = :=20 > > > >=20 > > > > Do we also want to clean our gav? Artifact=3Dspec, major.minor = version =3Dspec version=20 > > > >=20 > > > > Ex: org.apache.geronimo.specs:jsp:2.1.1=20 > > > >=20 > > > > Le sam. 4 mai 2019 =C3=A0 21:49, Romain Manni-Bucau = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > >=20 > > > >=20 > > > > Le sam. 4 mai 2019 =C3=A0 21:44, Mark Struberg = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > > The problem is that in a git repo you can only release all at = once. That means we would need to have a single git repo for each and = every spec. That will be quite many...=20 > > > >=20 > > > > No, maven plugins was a monorepo for years and then they split.=20= > > > >=20 > > > > That said i proposed that exactly for that. At the end the = release process is more on jira dev etc, one or N repos does not = compress that time. Release prepare/perform is very fast on these repo = so one or 100 is likely the same for release manager and seems it will = also enable better osgi support and probably - hopefully - enable = servicemix to stop forking the fork ;).=20 > > > >=20 > > > > I also see svn as legacy now gitbox is mainstream and people = contributing like to see their name in - I expect maybe some help for = new spec as we got for each new version.=20 > > > > Fixed are generally trivial there and a good reason to use = github.=20 > > > >=20 > > > >=20 > > > > LieGrue,=20 > > > > strub=20 > > > >=20 > > > > > Am 04.05.2019 um 21:35 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = :=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > > AFAIK we dont have limitations there and can do share stuff = outside with jgit - but it is very rare - so probably sane to unify all = repo to git. In particular since we will not do all specs probably. Cxf = already moved to jakarta spec so we dont need jaxrs stack for instance, = same for cdi, bval,... So we wil reduce a lot what we fork IMHO.=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > > Le sam. 4 mai 2019 =C3=A0 21:12, Mark Struberg = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > > > I=E2=80=99d keep that in svn because of the tons of modules.=20= > > > > >=20 > > > > > Lg,=20 > > > > > Strub=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > > Am 04.05.2019 um 19:28 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = :=20 > > > > >=20 > > > > >> We mainly fork for legal reasons and defaults so name is = probably not critical while we respect module names.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> Btw do we do it in gitbox? Svn had some limitations by the = past for contributions.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> Le sam. 4 mai 2019 =C3=A0 17:47, Raymond Auge = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > > >> One thing to consider is there may be cases where it is = desirable to retain the javax API alongside some extra jakarta packages = & types.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> For example, for JAX-RS you may wish to add some newly = defined jakarta types (part of a new spec) which interact over the = original javax API.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> The result might be that "Jakarta EE REST" (a fictitious name = for next JAX-RS) might contain a subset of packages which, in = combination with JAXRS v2.1, also qualifies as "Jakarata EE Rest".=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> - Ray=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> On Sat, May 4, 2019 at 11:26 AM Raymond Auge = wrote:=20 > > > > >> so is this a matter of forking all the current specs into the = new namespace? Or is the intention to completely change the packages = in-place?=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> - Ray=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 1:58 PM Romain Manni-Bucau = wrote:=20 > > > > >> Hmm=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> My understanding was it was getting under eclipse license as = well and was fully donated but can have missed some details.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> If we cant reuse them let's just create new ones and fix = module name for others.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> specs/ is fine since it is the same for us IMHO=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> Le ven. 3 mai 2019 =C3=A0 18:24, Mark Struberg = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > > >> No, it is not the same. microprofile specs are licensed under = ALv2 and we know all the legal details.=20 > > > > >> For the EE specs this is by far not the same. We don't even = know exactly what parts did yet get donated by Oracle to the EF.=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> LieGrue,=20 > > > > >> strub=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> > Am 03.05.2019 um 18:12 schrieb Romain Manni-Bucau = :=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> > Hi=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> > Idnt it the exact same as for microprofile? So we dont do?=20= > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> > Le ven. 3 mai 2019 =C3=A0 16:21, Mark Struberg = a =C3=A9crit :=20 > > > > >> > I've started tinkering something under = specs/branches/jakarta.=20 > > > > >> > It's wip but have to rush out for a few hours now.=20 > > > > >> > Will continue later today.=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> > LieGrue,=20 > > > > >> > strub=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >> > > Am 03.05.2019 um 15:50 schrieb Mark Struberg = :=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > hi folks!=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > You might have read todays post from Mike Milinkovich.=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > = https://eclipse-foundation.blog/2019/05/03/jakarta-ee-java-trademarks/=20= > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > It basically says that Jakarta will not be able to change = a single bit in the current spec apis under the javax.* package.=20 > > > > >> > > Any change has to be done in a different package.=20 > > > > >> > > The Jakarta people over at Eclipse already did some = voting and the new package name will be jakarta.*=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > Thus I would like to recommend to use our IP clean = geronimo-specs to setup a new project for the EE8 specs under the = jakarta.* package name.=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > I'll go forward and create a branch starting with the = most important specs.=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > Any feedback and help is welcome!=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> > > LieGrue,=20 > > > > >> > > strub=20 > > > > >> > >=20 > > > > >> >=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> --=20 > > > > >> Raymond Aug=C3=A9 (@rotty3000)=20 > > > > >> Senior Software Architect Liferay, Inc. (@Liferay)=20 > > > > >> Board Member & EEG Co-Chair, OSGi Alliance (@OSGiAlliance)=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >>=20 > > > > >> --=20 > > > > >> Raymond Aug=C3=A9 (@rotty3000)=20 > > > > >> Senior Software Architect Liferay, Inc. (@Liferay)=20 > > > > >> Board Member & EEG Co-Chair, OSGi Alliance (@OSGiAlliance)=20 > > > >=20 > > >=20 > >=20 >=20