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From: Andy Wenk <andy@nms.de>
Date: Thu, 7 May 2015 11:41:10 +0200
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 <CADA9kr-0aF3nLThMCKMuRfuY=dCKAuUoUXO8o4CC2+4cYvZTYg@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Jan bias for Hoodie brought him to eradicate couchapps?!?!
To: Giovanni Lenzi <g.lenzi@smileupps.com>
Cc: "dev@couchdb.apache.org" <dev@couchdb.apache.org>,
	"marketing@couchdb.apache.org" <marketing@couchdb.apache.org>,
	"user@couchdb.apache.org" <user@couchdb.apache.org>
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Hi Giovanni,

thanks a lot for your reply. I am looking forward working on this with you
to find a good solution for everyone ;-)

Cheers

Andy

On 7 May 2015 at 10:53, Giovanni Lenzi <g.lenzi@smileupps.com> wrote:

> Ok Andy,
>
> I'm very sorry for the tone.
>
> Yes, that's my very personal fear of this story... but it was all that
> happened that lead me to these considerations. Also the fact that
> Iriscouch, which is advocated by Jan and has Couch in its name, is still
> there, sounded strange to me.
>
> However I trust you, and I want to trust that PMC is acting solely to
> address project health. Really :)
>
> Smileupps is biased of course, there are no hidden secrets here: we are a
> CouchDB hosting and our business is around CouchDB and Couchapps. But we
> are helping with free hosting and tutorials and we would like to promote
> such a great thing called Couchapp. We don't want to add our specific
> feature or remove anything, couchapps are already there.
>
> > Please accept this and help us further to achieve this goal
> Of course, I hope I may help you further to achieve it.
>
> Cheers
>
> 2015-05-07 10:17 GMT+02:00 Andy Wenk <andy@nms.de>:
>
>> Hi Giovanni,
>>
>> I don't like the underlying tone of your email. You are missing one
>> important thing here and I ask you friendly to keep this in mind for
>> further communications. Jan is the Vice President of Apache CouchDB.
>> Without any question I can confirm, that he is able to separate between
>> the
>> Apache CouchDB project and Hoodie.
>>
>> The point we asked you to change the name of your service has solely to do
>> with guidelines we are following and you did not follow. This has not at
>> all to do with anything regarding the companies we work for (Cloudant,
>> Hoodie ...) but solely the Apache CouchDB project.
>>
>> What I can read between the lines of the email above is fear to loose a
>> core concept you have built your service on and the Apache CouchDB project
>> trying to rip this off. This is not true at all. We try to find a solution
>> for ways to make CouchDB more awesome. Please accept this and help us
>> further to achieve this goal.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Andy
>>
>> On 7 May 2015 at 05:13, Giovanni Lenzi <g.lenzi@smileupps.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Jan.. don't you think you are simply too biased for external projects,
>> such
>> > as your hoodie and pouchdb, to choose by your own, on a topic like
>> > 'retiring couchapps', so important to couchdb users and devs?
>> >
>> > You REALLY can't mask it behind a marketing@ decision, of finding a
>> story
>> > you have already written, since a long time, and that you simply
>> don'want
>> > to change. Your story of the "data where you need it", does not have
>> users
>> > and industries consensus. You can't hide it!
>> >
>> > You started with changing tooling names, sutting down couchapp domains
>> and
>> > forcing our company to change our old couchappy name (even if couchapp
>> > wasn't even a trademark). We did it, because you promised visibility to
>> us
>> > and couchapps, which has never happened. We believed in your words and
>> in
>> > an healty pmc, but after this last move, we really can't think it
>> anymore.
>> >
>> > Couchapps are now much more powerful than they were in the past, also
>> > thanks to our smileupps tutorials and app store platform, and to many
>> other
>> > improvements proposal already advanced by users, who instead would like
>> to
>> > improve them, not the contrary!!!
>> >
>> > Your chance now is to completely eradicate a main recruiting couchdb
>> > feature, before users can get aware of its potential, leading couchdb
>> > towards a probable self-killing action. And the worst is you are doing
>> > this, without any proven evidence and motivation, withouth asking devs
>> of
>> > its development complexity, and users what they think about it.
>> >
>> > I definetely think you should:
>> > 1. HEAR YOUR COMMUNITY AND DEVS.. and if the consensus is 'don't remove
>> > couchapps, but push them with aggressive marketing'.. well then.. just
>> do
>> > it!
>> > 2. Don't mark it absolutely as a marketing issue
>> >
>> > And you sould do this, before this could really be faced in front of the
>> > ASF board.
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Andy Wenk
>> Hamburg - Germany
>> RockIt!
>>
>> http://www.couchdb-buch.de
>> http://www.pg-praxisbuch.de
>>
>> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588
>>
>> https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Giovanni Lenzi
> www.smileupps.com
> Smileupps Couchapps Store
>


-- 
Andy Wenk
Hamburg - Germany
RockIt!

http://www.couchdb-buch.de
http://www.pg-praxisbuch.de

GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588

https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc

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