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From Andy Wenk <>
Subject Fwd: Jan bias for Hoodie brought him to eradicate couchapps?!?!
Date Thu, 07 May 2015 09:38:48 GMT
fyi ...
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Giovanni Lenzi <>
Date: 7 May 2015 at 10:53
Subject: Re: Jan bias for Hoodie brought him to eradicate couchapps?!?!

Ok Andy,

I'm very sorry for the tone.

Yes, that's my very personal fear of this story... but it was all that
happened that lead me to these considerations. Also the fact that
Iriscouch, which is advocated by Jan and has Couch in its name, is still
there, sounded strange to me.

However I trust you, and I want to trust that PMC is acting solely to
address project health. Really :)

Smileupps is biased of course, there are no hidden secrets here: we are a
CouchDB hosting and our business is around CouchDB and Couchapps. But we
are helping with free hosting and tutorials and we would like to promote
such a great thing called Couchapp. We don't want to add our specific
feature or remove anything, couchapps are already there.

> Please accept this and help us further to achieve this goal
Of course, I hope I may help you further to achieve it.


2015-05-07 10:17 GMT+02:00 Andy Wenk <>:

> Hi Giovanni,
> I don't like the underlying tone of your email. You are missing one
> important thing here and I ask you friendly to keep this in mind for
> further communications. Jan is the Vice President of Apache CouchDB.
> Without any question I can confirm, that he is able to separate between the
> Apache CouchDB project and Hoodie.
> The point we asked you to change the name of your service has solely to do
> with guidelines we are following and you did not follow. This has not at
> all to do with anything regarding the companies we work for (Cloudant,
> Hoodie ...) but solely the Apache CouchDB project.
> What I can read between the lines of the email above is fear to loose a
> core concept you have built your service on and the Apache CouchDB project
> trying to rip this off. This is not true at all. We try to find a solution
> for ways to make CouchDB more awesome. Please accept this and help us
> further to achieve this goal.
> Cheers
> Andy
> On 7 May 2015 at 05:13, Giovanni Lenzi <> wrote:
> > Jan.. don't you think you are simply too biased for external projects,
> such
> > as your hoodie and pouchdb, to choose by your own, on a topic like
> > 'retiring couchapps', so important to couchdb users and devs?
> >
> > You REALLY can't mask it behind a marketing@ decision, of finding a
> story
> > you have already written, since a long time, and that you simply don'want
> > to change. Your story of the "data where you need it", does not have
> users
> > and industries consensus. You can't hide it!
> >
> > You started with changing tooling names, sutting down couchapp domains
> and
> > forcing our company to change our old couchappy name (even if couchapp
> > wasn't even a trademark). We did it, because you promised visibility to
> us
> > and couchapps, which has never happened. We believed in your words and in
> > an healty pmc, but after this last move, we really can't think it
> anymore.
> >
> > Couchapps are now much more powerful than they were in the past, also
> > thanks to our smileupps tutorials and app store platform, and to many
> other
> > improvements proposal already advanced by users, who instead would like
> to
> > improve them, not the contrary!!!
> >
> > Your chance now is to completely eradicate a main recruiting couchdb
> > feature, before users can get aware of its potential, leading couchdb
> > towards a probable self-killing action. And the worst is you are doing
> > this, without any proven evidence and motivation, withouth asking devs of
> > its development complexity, and users what they think about it.
> >
> > I definetely think you should:
> > 1. HEAR YOUR COMMUNITY AND DEVS.. and if the consensus is 'don't remove
> > couchapps, but push them with aggressive marketing'.. well then.. just do
> > it!
> > 2. Don't mark it absolutely as a marketing issue
> >
> > And you sould do this, before this could really be faced in front of the
> > ASF board.
> >
> --
> Andy Wenk
> Hamburg - Germany
> RockIt!
> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588

Giovanni Lenzi
Smileupps Couchapps Store

Andy Wenk
Hamburg - Germany

GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588

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