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From Brian Devins-Suresh <badev...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Withdraw from the Apache Incubator
Date Fri, 14 Jun 2019 13:07:59 GMT
+1 the pain/gain ratio was too high

On Fri, Jun 14, 2019 at 4:10 AM <bas@tobin.nl> wrote:

> +1
>
> > Op 14 jun. 2019, om 04:24 heeft Adrian Cole <adriancole@apache.org> het
> volgende geschreven:
> >
> > The PPMC held a vote on our private list to withdraw from the Apache
> > Incubator. We did this for reason of discretion, similar to how new
> > PPMC members are voted in, and for lack of any formal process to
> > conduct such a vote. John D. Ament asked us to vote again "to keep our
> > own processes simple", so this vote is in accordance with that
> > request.
> >
> > 8 votes to leave carry over from the private list, including 7 of our
> > 12 PPMC members [1]. There were no 0 or -1 votes cast.
> >
> > IPMC +1 Sheng Wu
> > PPMC +7 Adrian Cole, Bas van Beek, José Carlos Chávez, Kristof
> > Adriaenssens, Jorge Esteban Quilcate Otoya, Brian Devins-Suresh, Lance
> > Linder
> >
> > Here's the private thread:
> >
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/b47dc4cdce50ca5d4229d73d2ac745904e3a4b70bebfabe1cbf7c55a@%3Cprivate.zipkin.apache.org%3E
> >
> > Below is the description of the vote, which we'll extend here for 72
> > hours. Folks who have formerly voted can feel free to vote again.
> > ----
> >
> > It has been the experience from more than one of us that the Apache
> > Incubator is more stressful and requires more effort than initially
> > anticipated or is necessary. This vote recommends we leave the
> > incubator back to the OpenZipkin org and carry on as we did.
> >
> > Here is some background. I will not cite here. If you are a committer
> > you can also express your point of view with or without citing. Your
> > opinions matter and I hope you all vote.
> >
> > Process and policy ambiguity has been ever present and cost us a lot
> > of time and energy. The incubator spends more energy on failing us
> > than helping us. Tooling gaps, whether related to process management,
> > source verification or multiple repositories have impacted us as well.
> > We have lost considerable velocity since attempting to join. Even if
> > we graduate, there is no guarantee strictness felt so far won't carry
> > over.
> >
> > The burdens don't stop here, there is a lot of fear about our greater
> > community, OpenZipkin and how to fireproof branding across what is
> > Apache and what is not. This is not only a cultural miss for us, but
> > yet more overhead and also tension. We still have to maintain the old
> > namespace, and we also get tension from the incubator that the old
> > namespace exists. Probably many projects can control their whole
> > ecosystem but we cannot and as far as I know do not desire to either.
> > We are all the same class.
> >
> > Some large projects can afford incubator strictness and carry on
> > despite these hurdles and lack of tools. Small or mono repo projects
> > have far less work anyway. Those with larger projects usually have
> > fulltime staff to address the gaps, write nice websites navigating
> > process, make tools etc. It is costly and we are frankly by definition
> > not rich.
> >
> > Moreover, OpenZipkin is culturally against building things that
> > require effort to get working. Our very first act as a part of a
> > community was to remove the burden of forcing users to build from
> > source. There is definitely conflict with us and a culture preoccupied
> > with source ceremony and without interest to the impacts on volunteers
> > or the quality if the experience. This mismatch has led to many
> > problems that distract us from our purpose as a project in ways
> > including time displacement and low morale. This is despite multiple
> > escalations from our mentors.
> >
> > For reasons of resources, poor experience and cultural
> > incompatibility, I recommend we leave the incubator and re-unify as
> > OpenZipkin again.
> >
> > If you vote -1, it is to remain. Please mention concrete efforts you
> > will take personally to address the problems, and which
> > responsibilities you will take on, if you vote -1.
> >
> > Voting ends 3 days from today, i.e. midnight UTC on 2019-06-17
> > http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/customcounter.html?year=2019&month=
> > 06&day=17
> >
> > [1] https://whimsy.apache.org/roster/ppmc/zipkin
> >
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> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@zipkin.apache.org
> >
>
>
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>

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