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From "Robert Koberg" <...@koberg.com>
Subject Re: axkit and patents (fwd)
Date Mon, 21 Jan 2002 20:50:48 GMT
maybe apache could use the aclu to splatter patents on little cogs in the
wheel???


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Finneran" <rob@digitalskyscrapers.com>
To: <general@xml.apache.org>
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 12:42 PM
Subject: RE: axkit and patents (fwd)


> FYI:
>
> >From an article in "Think" magazine, #5, 1990.
>
>     "You get value from patents in two ways," says Roger Smith, IBM
>     Assistant General Counsel, intellectual property law.  "Through fees,
>     and through licensing negotiations that give IBM access to other
>     patents.
>
>     "The IBM patent portfolio gains us the freedom to do what we need to
>     do through cross-licensing--it gives us access to the inventions of
>     others that are the key to rapid innovation.  Access is far more
>     valuable to IBM than the fees it receives from its 9,000 active
>     patents.  There's no direct calculation of this value, but it's many
>     times larger than the fee income, perhaps an order of magnitude
>     larger."
>
> This article should dispell the idea that the patent system will
> "protect" a small software developer from competition from IBM.  IBM
> can always find patents in its collection which the small developer is
> infringing, and thus obtain a cross-license.
>
> However, the patent system does cause trouble for the smaller
> companies which, like IBM, need access to patented techniques in order
> to do useful work in software.  Unlike IBM, the smaller companies do
> not have 9,000 patents and cannot usually get a cross-license.  No
> matter how hard they try, they cannot amass enough patents to defend
> themselves.
>
> How much trouble do patents typically cause?  The value IBM gets from
> cross-licensing measures the trouble that the patent system would
> cause IBM if IBM could not avoid it.  IBM's estimate is that the
> trouble could easily be ten times the good one can expect from one's
> own patents--even for a company with 9,000 of them.
>
> For IBM, this trouble is hypothetical--cross-licensing prevents it
> from happening.  For ordinary companies which cannot do likewise, the
> burden is real.  IBM's estimate suggests that for a typical software
> company, patents will do ten times as much harm as good.  Only the
> elimination of patents from the software field can enable most
> software developers to continue with their work.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Finneran [mailto:rob@digitalskyscrapers.com]
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 12:17 PM
> To: general@xml.apache.org
> Subject: RE: axkit and patents (fwd)
>
>
> Hello,
>
> I think the tech community needs to take a stand against this kind of
> outrageous behavior. I cannot believe that Sun does not understand that
this
> patent application is just plain wrong. I don't even have to explain why
> this is wrong, just read the text of it.
>
> The worse part is that those idiots over in the patent office are likely
to
> approve the patent. Making patent mistakes helps evolve patent law. The
> trouble is, challenging a patent usually costs millions of dollars. It's a
> game only rich companies can play.
>
> Someday I hope that software engineers wake up to the threat of their
> freedom. Soon the only protection you will have against this sort of abuse
> of the free market system is to only work for major corporations who can
> afford to play in this arena. They cross-license each other's patents to
> create oligopolies that can "legally" restrain free trade. Independent
> software companies without vast patent portfolios of their own will not
have
> anything to trade in settlement negotiations.
>
> Is this simply a paranoid view of our trade? I think not. Look at the
> evidence.
>
> Rob
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Matt Sergeant [mailto:matt@sergeant.org]
> Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 11:50 AM
> To: general@xml.apache.org
> Subject: axkit and patents (fwd)
>
>
> Looks like Sun are trying to Patent what AxKit and Cocoon can do. We need
> to make sure the patent office knows of the prior art on this. Do we have
> people who do that sort of thing?
>
> --
> <!-- Matt -->
> <:->Get a smart net</:->
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 19:39:30 +0000
> From: Sebastian Rahtz <sebastian.rahtz@computing-services.oxford.ac.uk>
> To: "axkit-users@axkit.org" <axkit-users@axkit.org>
> Subject: axkit and patents
>
> have y'all seen this arrant nonsense from Sun?
> http://l2.espacenet.com/dips/viewer?PN=WO0163481&CY=ep&LG=en&DB=EPD
> describes a patent application which is a trivial AxKit
> operation.....
> --
> Sebastian Rahtz      OUCS Information Manager
> 13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865 283431
>
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