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From Davanum Srinivas <d...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: Business-Oriented XML
Date Sun, 18 Nov 2001 01:42:16 GMT
Dave,

Please move this discussion over to cocoon-dev mailing list if you really want good feedback.
You
will find that the people over there are quite ready to accept new concepts, criticism, patches,
contributions etc :)

Thanks,
dims

--- Jeff Turner <jeff@socialchange.net.au> wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 16, 2001 at 08:58:06PM -0800, Dave Jarvis wrote:
> > Hello, again.
> > 
> > Neeme Praks wrote:
> > > Have you ever had a look at Apache Cocoon project? That achieves all the
> > 
> > Yes.
> > 
> > > benefits you outlined in your paper plus more.
> > 
> > Here are a few items BOX addresses that Cocoon does not (as far as I can
> > discern; please correct my errors):
> > 
> > 	o doesn't provide an inherent state-based architecture (it's an aside,
> > not focus)
> 
> Nope, they threw out the "reactor" (state machine) pattern as being too
> hard to manage.
> 
> > 	o doesn't automatically apply a different view of logic based on the
> > domain
> 
> Certainly can :) Have a look at Cocoon 2's class
> org.apache.cocoon.selection.HostSelector.
> 
> > 	o extremely complex; it mixes multiple languages and odd syntax (e.g.,
> > &connectDatabase)
> 
> That's just your particular XSP, which uses an XML entity
> "&connectDatabase;" to pull in other XSP. If you put your logic in
> logicsheets as intended, then your XSP pages are pure XML.
> 
> > 	o makes it easy to couple presentation and logic (see below)
> 
> Actually, XSP makes it easy to mix *content* and logic (presentation is
> in XSLs).
> 
> > 	o lacks an integrated expression parser
> > 	o doesn't expose a consistent syntax for doing tasks such as:
> > 		- file I/O
> > 		- sending XML to remote servers
> 
> Have a look at Cocoon 2's xscript SOAP demo (xscript being an XSP
> equivalent of James Strachan's xtags taglib).
> 
> > 		- calling native code (Java, C, Perl, etc.)
> > 		- SQL statements
> > 	o cookies, FORM parameters, and URL encoded variables are not treated
> > uniformly
> > 	o doesn't use plain XML (i.e., embeds other language source directly)
> 
> Anyway, if you've got time, hop on cocoon-dev.. I'm sure there's much
> mutual learning to be had (it's a fun place to lurk anyway). Cocoon 2
> has a very generic architecture, and I've no doubt that your code could
> be integrated as an XSP alternative.
> 
> 
> --Jeff
> 
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=====
Davanum Srinivas - http://jguru.com/dims/

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