www-legal-discuss mailing list archives

Site index · List index
Message view « Date » · « Thread »
Top « Date » · « Thread »
From Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>
Subject Re: What kind of metrics / telemetry is an Apache project allowed to record?
Date Thu, 02 Nov 2017 21:07:46 GMT
Other than making ourselves feel good, and convincing my manager to keep
paying me to work on Flex, I'm not sure we use our installation numbers
for much else.  What would you do differently if you had 10,000 users
instead of 1,000,000?

Anyway, Flex has a user-facing app to help with setup and AFAICT it has
been approved to hit a URL on flex.a.o that is tracked by GA.  I don't see
why you can't propose to do something like that with your user-facing app
and seek approval.

-Alex

On 11/2/17, 7:08 AM, "Emilian Bold" <emilian.bold@gmail.com> wrote:

>The ASF should be a bit more proactive in this regard.
>
>Apache JMeter has no user base info except what they can infer from Stack
>overflow questions, the mailing list or statistics provided by a 3rd
>party, for years!
>
>What I've noticed from Apache NetBeans (incubating) is that users *do
>not* come forward even to criticize you. They are somewhere, using your
>product but without reporting any issue, commenting on a forum, going to
>meetups, etc. Total radio silence.
>
>And NetBeans has 3,000,000 users! (I know this because it did send usage
>stats, with the user consent, under Oracle)
>
>Does Apache just not have that many user facing apps?
>
>Still, even some library author must care about download numbers at
>least. Or if old, insecure versions are still being downloaded (or in
>use!) See Struts.
>
>--emi
>
>Pe 2 nov. 2017, la 15:27, Shane Curcuru <asf@shanecurcuru.org> a scris:
>
>> Briefly:
>> 
>> - Projects are welcome to use Google Analytics, and either copy and add
>> to or simply point to the ASF-wide privacy policy:
>> 
>>  
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.apac
>>he.org%2Ffoundation%2Fpolicies%2Fprivacy.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7C89131eb3f
>>50d4f8346cb08d521fb26b8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6364
>>52284934042456&sdata=dJ8H1gquAdeyKLhccwVuzCeN99Dw7Y7%2BmwkkuQhqpEY%3D&res
>>erved=0
>> 
>> Other sorts of website/user tracking systems that can respect privacy
>> laws around the world (i.e. US, EU, and elsewhere!) might be OK.  The
>> best thing is for projects to define a more specific need and software
>> product they want to use, and then file a LEGAL JIRA ticket to get a
>> specific answer about "is this software & privacy policy OK to use".
>> 
>> - In terms of download tracking, the issue is that the ASF relies on a
>> large mirror network to actually fulfill downloads.  Thus there are
>> limited statistics that we can ask the mirrors to provide (they all
>> provide this service to us for free, and it's a critical resource).
>> 
>> The best place to ask for finding ways to improve download tracking for
>> your project is bringing a specific request to infra:
>> 
>>  
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.apac
>>he.org%2Fdev%2Finfra-contact&data=02%7C01%7C%7C89131eb3f50d4f8346cb08d521
>>fb26b8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452284934042456&sd
>>ata=zzwYTno%2FwOamnql75Drp0Crk6WgYDLgzniAxHmwcQYE%3D&reserved=0
>> 
>> - The separate question of having a product phone home is best answered
>> by having a more specific question. What specific data are you
>> collecting; how does opt-in/opt-out work for users; what will the
>> benefit for the project as a whole be?
>> 
>> - Shane
>> 
>> Emilian Bold wrote on 10/30/17 5:56 PM:
>>> Hello,
>>> 
>>> We have very little metrics from ASF for Apache JMeter and the best
>>> source seems to be a 3rd party site that has a popular plugin portal
>>> and records more information.
>>> 
>>> This is a pretty sad state of affairs:
>>> 
>>> * downloads are not counted very accurately. I discovered there are
>>> some text logs on
>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww-us.a
>>>pache.org%2Fdyn%2Fstats%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C89131eb3f50d4f8346cb08d521f
>>>b26b8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452284934042456&sd
>>>ata=wiVtcwwJqd2la5odPgdCJ0ZwQS%2F05mNmF6A9yQfZ%2B%2Fk%3D&reserved=0 but
>>>these are
>>> very approximate and the mirrors send no logs back to Apache for
>>> centralisation or such.
>>> 
>>> * website logs are on-demand only. I see the ASF does use Google
>>> Analytics as per
>>> 
>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.apa
>>>che.org%2Ffoundation%2Fpolicies%2Fprivacy.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7C89131eb
>>>3f50d4f8346cb08d521fb26b8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6
>>>36452284934042456&sdata=dJ8H1gquAdeyKLhccwVuzCeN99Dw7Y7%2BmwkkuQhqpEY%3D
>>>&reserved=0 but individual
>>> projects don't (can't?) so we only have server logs(?)
>>> 
>>> It would be interesting to
>>> 
>>> * record version information, operating system, popular plugins
>>>ourselves
>>> 
>>> * allow users to send an error "to us" when it happens (error
>>>reporting).
>>> 
>>> So, what kind of privacy policy must we follow for such a feature and
>>> how can INFRA help us with a server to receive these messages?
>>> 
>>> Having more info about the current state and the trend of our user
>>> base would allow some better planning since everybody is
>>> time-constrained.
>>> 
>>> Having this info under our control would allow us to actually follow a
>>> given privacy policy instead of relying on a 3rd party site that does
>>> not even *have* a privacy policy.
>>> 
>>> Some of these questions apply to Apache NetBeans too, as we have a
>>> very nice error reporting mechanism there with a custom server backend
>>> for detecting duplicates, statistics and such.
>>> 
>>> --emi
>>> 
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: legal-discuss-unsubscribe@apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: legal-discuss-help@apache.org
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> - Shane
>>  
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.apac
>>he.org%2Ffoundation%2Fmarks%2Fresources&data=02%7C01%7C%7C89131eb3f50d4f8
>>346cb08d521fb26b8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6364522849
>>34042456&sdata=428bZjhiCZE0jqZwRc3Prhw%2BcqNQXUw1tIB1C4Lb4wM%3D&reserved=
>>0
>> 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: legal-discuss-unsubscribe@apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: legal-discuss-help@apache.org
>> 
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>To unsubscribe, e-mail: legal-discuss-unsubscribe@apache.org
>For additional commands, e-mail: legal-discuss-help@apache.org
>

Mime
View raw message