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From Chris Mattmann <mattm...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Absolving the IPMC of IP Clearances
Date Mon, 22 May 2017 02:19:06 GMT
Thanks Craig. Yeah I think this needs some mulling over. I’ll read the below, and get back
to folks.


As an FYI my backlog for this position is already growing, so to manage expectations, and
so that

folks don’t expect immediate replies on this stuff, I can imagine at the current rate of
things to 
consider we are perhaps a month or two or three from some of these decisions being made. I’ll
do them as fast as I can with as much input from everyone as I can.


Thanks for sourcing this Craig.








From: Craig Russell <apache.clr@gmail.com>
Reply-To: "legal-discuss@apache.org" <legal-discuss@apache.org>
Date: Sunday, May 21, 2017 at 6:30 PM
To: "legal-discuss@apache.org" <legal-discuss@apache.org>
Subject: Re: Absolving the IPMC of IP Clearances


The IP Clearance has some history. I did a bit of archeology and found some interesting bits
from ca. 2008. And some more from the year immediately after the Incubator was formed. 










This is from http://www.apache.org/foundation/records/minutes/2003/board_minutes_2003_12_17.txt


B. Discussion: code imports directly into projects vs incubation
       (e.g. maven-wagon and ws-fx)
       A discussion was had on how codebases arrive at the ASF.  Last
       year, the Board created the Apache Incubator Project to deal
       with these incoming codebases, primary to ensure that the
       proper IP guarantees have been made, and also to ensure that
       any community arriving with the code is aware of ASF processes
       and requirements.
       However, there are many cases where codebases happen to have
       been elsewhere by ASF committers, which makes it much easier to
       "bring the code [into the ASF]". The Board is crafting
       guidelines for when a codebase can be directly imported and
       verified by a PMC, and when it is required to use the Incubator
       for that process. Information will be posted to
       general@incubator.apache.org when those guidelines have been

I have run out of time now to do more investigation, but please rest assured that many people
have been involved over the years in the issues related to bringing code bases into the ASF
and whatever we want to change, it's not a trivial task.





On May 21, 2017, at 2:13 PM, John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org> wrote:



On Sun, May 21, 2017 at 5:12 PM Roman Shaposhnik <roman@shaposhnik.org> wrote:

On Sun, May 21, 2017 at 2:06 PM, John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org> wrote:
> All, Specifically the new VP Legal,
> The IPMC has struggled for a while being the gatekeepers for IP Clearance
> for the entire foundation.  Several of us over the years have raised
> concerns with this process.  It probably made sense when all new code went
> through the incubator, but these days much new code goes directly to the
> TLPs accepting them.
> I'd like to question this practice, and see if there's any additional
> guidance on how to handle IP Clearances, is this really an IPMC
> responsibility?

Here's the way I think about it: a whole bunch of code coming into the community
all at once has two implications:
   1. licensing
   2. community support

Licensing is easy when that whole bunch of code was written on behalf of a given
legal entity (lets say by employees of the corp X that also happen to
be part of
the community). In this case SGA from corp X is all that's required to
license the
code to ASF. TLPs should file it with secretary@ and not really
involve IPMC much
at all.

Licensing gets complicated if that whole bunch of code was written by a group
of committers without a clear IP provenance (such as an explicit ICLA). In this
case it actually dovetails into #2 on my list -- so lets talk about that.

#2 is when its not just code that will be joining a TLP, but a brand
new sub-community.
In those cases actual incubation may make sense. This is the only
place where I could
see IPMC getting involved for a good reason.

Makes sense?


Agreed - except that I think #2 is a question that the receiving project needs to decide -
does this new project need to incubate or immediately become part of our TLP.  Recent history
indicates most of the time, its straight to the TLP.  Obviously the IPMC is there to help
if they choose to incubate.



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Craig L Russell
Secretary, Apache Software Foundation
clr@apache.org http://db.apache.org/jdo


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