Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public-internal@cust-asf2.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public-internal@cust-asf2.ponee.io Received: from cust-asf.ponee.io (cust-asf.ponee.io [163.172.22.183]) by cust-asf2.ponee.io (Postfix) with ESMTP id D528E200B85 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 20:40:14 +0200 (CEST) Received: by cust-asf.ponee.io (Postfix) id D3AFD160AC6; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:14 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by cust-asf.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id CB6DD160ABA for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 20:40:13 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 45829 invoked by uid 500); 15 Sep 2016 18:40:12 -0000 Mailing-List: contact legal-discuss-help@apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: Reply-To: legal-discuss@apache.org List-Id: Delivered-To: mailing list legal-discuss@apache.org Received: (qmail 45815 invoked by uid 99); 15 Sep 2016 18:40:12 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd1-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:12 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd1-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd1-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 35559C0D4E for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:12 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd1-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.594 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.594 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[HTML_MESSAGE=2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.614] autolearn=disabled Received: from mx1-lw-eu.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd1-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.7]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PmN6SUVDkpFG for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp687.redcondor.net (smtp687.redcondor.net [208.80.206.87]) by mx1-lw-eu.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-eu.apache.org) with ESMTPS id A5DC15F246 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailproxy12.neonova.net ([137.118.22.77]) by smtp687.redcondor.net ({f50aeeea-7a14-4dd3-bdda-1246754c15b3}) via TCP (outbound) with ESMTP id 20160915184007465_0687 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:07 +0000 X-RC-FROM: X-RC-RCPT: Received: from [10.9.100.113] (unknown [208.93.128.118]) (Authenticated sender: ralph.goers@dslextreme.com) by mailproxy12.neonova.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 4714C36008D for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2016 14:40:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Ralph Goers Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_73014D92-2339-418B-BE5C-53CB9DBACD53" Message-Id: <715E5B83-A701-4FC9-8EB8-277C5695E590@dslextreme.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) Subject: Re: Is Spark Kinesis (non-assembly) module distributable via Maven? Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2016 11:40:02 -0700 References: <6F1BB880-E635-4BAF-9944-7727D80EEA80@dslextreme.com> To: Legal Discuss In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-DLP-OUTBOUND: 137.118.22.64/27 X-MAG-OUTBOUND: greymail.redcondor.net@137.118.22.64/27 archived-at: Thu, 15 Sep 2016 18:40:15 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_73014D92-2339-418B-BE5C-53CB9DBACD53 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Or maybe I=E2=80=99m unclear. Is this a packaging question that you = have to include Kinesis in your binary distribution? Ralph > On Sep 15, 2016, at 11:38 AM, Ralph Goers = wrote: >=20 > Exactly my point. it sounds like this optional feature has a platform = dependency on Kinesis. There is nothing wrong with that. >=20 > Ralph >=20 >=20 >> On Sep 15, 2016, at 9:24 AM, Alex Harui > wrote: >>=20 >> AIUI, Windows is considered a platform or runtime environment and = thus exempted. >>=20 >> From: Ralph Goers > >> Reply-To: "legal-discuss@apache.org = " > >> Date: Thursday, September 15, 2016 at 8:33 AM >> To: Legal Discuss > >> Subject: Re: Is Spark Kinesis (non-assembly) module distributable via = Maven? >>=20 >> How is this different than building something that requires Windows? = See http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#platform = . >>=20 >> Ralph >>=20 >>> On Sep 14, 2016, at 2:21 AM, Sean Owen > wrote: >>>=20 >>> Hello legal-discuss@, >>>=20 >>> On behalf of Spark I'm writing to ask for opinions on the additional = question raised at = https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-198?focusedCommentId=3D1547152= 9&page=3Dcom.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel#= comment-15471529 = . >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> In brief, Spark has several optional modules that are not = distributed as part of the main binary release. One of them is "Spark = Kinesis", which contains integration code for Amazon's Kinesis. (Note: = here we are not talking about the Kinesis _assembly_ module.) This = module is built and distributed as a binary artifact in Maven, however.=20= >>>=20 >>> It does not itself contain any source or binary code from the Amazon = Kinesis client. However, this optional Spark Kinesis module requires the = Kinesis client of course. And, the Kinesis client is licensed under the = Amazon Software License, which is Category X. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#prohibited = says: >>> ----- >>> CAN APACHE PROJECTS RELY ON COMPONENTS UNDER PROHIBITED LICENSES? >>> Apache projects cannot distribute any such components. As with the = previous question on platforms, the component can be relied on if the = component's licence terms do not affect the Apache product's licensing. = For example, using a GPL'ed tool during the build is OK. >>>=20 >>> CAN APACHE PROJECTS RELY ON COMPONENTS WHOSE LICENSING AFFECTS THE = APACHE PRODUCT? >>> Apache projects cannot distribute any such components. However, if = the component is only needed for optional features, a project can = provide the user with instructions on how to obtain and install the = non-included work. Optional means that the component is not required for = standard use of the product or for the product to achieve a desirable = level of quality. The question to ask yourself in this situation is: >>>=20 >>> "Will the majority of users want to use my product without adding = the optional components?" >>> ----- >>>=20 >>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-198 = discusses = closely-related but not identical scenarios. For example, there the = question is whether ASF projects can distribute the recompiled binary = code of a Category X component, and that's not allowed. >>>=20 >>> Here, the licensing does affect the product (it is not just a build = dependency). >>>=20 >>> I see an argument for and against allowing publishing of Spark = Kinesis in Maven. >>>=20 >>> FOR: >>>=20 >>> Spark Kinesis is optional with respect to Spark, and thus so is = Kinesis client. Publishing it via Maven constitutes providing = "instructions on how to obtain and install the non-included work", = Kinesis client. >>>=20 >>> AGAINST: >>>=20 >>> Spark Kinesis is a software product from the ASF in and of itself. = If it relies non-optionally on a Category X component, it may not be = distributed. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Is there any view on which is more accurate in this context? >>> If the latter, does this forbid releasing Spark Kinesis in source = form too? >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Best, >>> Sean >>>=20 >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_73014D92-2339-418B-BE5C-53CB9DBACD53 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Or maybe I=E2=80=99m unclear.  Is this a = packaging question that you have to include Kinesis in your binary = distribution?

Ralph

On Sep 15, 2016, at 11:38 AM, Ralph Goers = <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com> wrote:

Exactly my = point. it sounds like this optional feature has a platform dependency on = Kinesis. There is nothing wrong with that.

Ralph


On Sep = 15, 2016, at 9:24 AM, Alex Harui <aharui@adobe.com> wrote:

AIUI, Windows is considered a platform or runtime = environment and thus exempted.

From: Ralph Goers = <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com>
Reply-To: "legal-discuss@apache.org" <legal-discuss@apache.org>
Date: Thursday, = September 15, 2016 at 8:33 AM
To: Legal Discuss = <legal-discuss@apache.org>
Subject: Re: Is Spark = Kinesis (non-assembly) module distributable via Maven?

How is this different than building something that = requires Windows?  See http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#platform.

Ralph

On Sep 14, 2016, at 2:21 AM, Sean Owen <srowen@apache.org> = wrote:

Hello legal-discuss@,

On behalf of Spark I'm writing to ask for opinions on = the additional question raised at = https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-198?focusedCommentId=3D1547152= 9&page=3Dcom.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpa= nel#comment-15471529 .


In brief, Spark has several optional modules that are = not distributed as part of the main binary release. One of them is = "Spark Kinesis", which contains integration code for Amazon's Kinesis. = (Note: here we are not talking about the Kinesis _assembly_ module.) This module is built and distributed as a binary artifact in = Maven, however. 

It does not itself contain any source or binary code = from the Amazon Kinesis client. However, this optional Spark Kinesis = module requires the Kinesis client of course. And, the Kinesis client is = licensed under the Amazon Software License, which is Category X.


http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#prohibited = says:
-----
CAN APACHE PROJECTS RELY ON COMPONENTS UNDER PROHIBITED = LICENSES?
Apache projects cannot distribute any such components. = As with the previous question on platforms, the component can be relied = on if the component's licence terms do not affect the Apache product's = licensing. For example, using a GPL'ed tool during the build is OK.

CAN APACHE PROJECTS RELY ON COMPONENTS WHOSE LICENSING = AFFECTS THE APACHE PRODUCT?
Apache projects cannot distribute any such components. = However, if the component is only needed for optional features, a = project can provide the user with instructions on how to obtain and = install the non-included work. Optional means that the component is not required for standard use of the product or for the = product to achieve a desirable level of quality. The question to ask = yourself in this situation is:

"Will the majority of users want to use my product = without adding the optional components?"
-----

https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-198 discusses = closely-related but not identical scenarios. For example, there the = question is whether ASF projects can distribute the recompiled binary code of a Category X component, and that's not = allowed.

Here, the licensing does affect the product (it is not = just a build dependency).

I see an argument for and against allowing publishing of = Spark Kinesis in Maven.

FOR:

Spark Kinesis is optional with respect to Spark, and = thus so is Kinesis client. Publishing it via Maven constitutes providing = "instructions on how to obtain and install the non-included work", = Kinesis client.

AGAINST:

Spark Kinesis is a software product from the ASF in and = of itself. If it relies non-optionally on a Category X component, it may = not be distributed.


Is there any view on which is more accurate in this = context?
If the latter, does this forbid releasing Spark Kinesis = in source form too?


Best,
Sean


= --Apple-Mail=_73014D92-2339-418B-BE5C-53CB9DBACD53--