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From "Dennis E. Hamilton" <dennis.hamil...@acm.org>
Subject RE: [jira] [Commented] (LEGAL-108) Compatibility with Unicode License
Date Mon, 14 Nov 2011 04:16:46 GMT
Hmm, this seems to be in the same curious category as schemas that are part of international
standards (and the specifications documents themselves, for that matter).

This is starting to look like an enumeration of blood types.  Anyone for type AB?

The Unicode Consortium code is seemingly benign and it would appear contorted to ban these
from Apache SVN.  There does need to be some 3rd party treatment, and an assertion to keep
the code tied to a NOTICE perhaps.  But perhaps that is not good enough?

SLIPPERY-SLOPE CROSSING AHEAD

It gets sticky when a derivative (including programming-language translation) is required.
 Part of the problem may be that there is no upstream to contribute back to but the derivative
is at the backbone of a processor implementation.  I suppose the same issue arises with schema
derivatives on behalf of an implementation too, although it looks like the use of derivatives
is more tolerable in the ODF case at least. 

[Watch out, here comes Bison and issues about compilation of instances of that application's
schema model to code.]

The schema and the Unicode cases are both ones that I expect to encounter in my personal work.
 Oddly, I can deal with these 3rd party cases in an ALv2-licensed project of my own but the
result could be toxic for contribution to Apache.  Not a new situation, and maybe the ASF
bright line here is essential to the purposes and policies of the ASF, no matter what.

ANECDOTE TIME

Many years ago (well, in the 70s) while thinking about computer chess for the fun of it, I
found an edge case in the rules for draw by repetition.  I managed to have a question submitted
to the FIDE via the USCF on completing the rule (so software could employ it correctly). 
The resolution is in the current rules for international play.  What I fancy about the resulting
determination is that it's unnecessary for a tournament director to be prescient and know
what future moves were not possible anyhow in considering what was different between otherwise
identical recurrences of the pieces on the board, with the same player to move.  Only the
history of the current state matters (this has to do with loss of the opportunity to make
an en passant capture and, of my concern, the right to castle).  

It seems that the wisdom behind the ASF policy has that quality.  Although I could argue that
quite naturally the code from the Unicode Consortium would not be useful for any other purpose,
that requires a level of prescience that is too complex to reliably adjudicate.  I might be
certain that I wasn't violating that restriction in a project of mine, but I would also have
to take some responsibility for how the source code and any derivation of it was fenced off
and the original license condition kept in place.  I can readily sympathize with ASF unwillingness
here, as awkward as some of these cases are when the line is drawn as sharply as it might.

 - Dennis

-----Original Message-----
From: Craig L Russell (Commented) (JIRA) [mailto:jira@apache.org] 
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 18:40
To: legal-discuss@apache.org
Subject: [jira] [Commented] (LEGAL-108) Compatibility with Unicode License


    [ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-108?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=13149416#comment-13149416
] 

Craig L Russell commented on LEGAL-108:
---------------------------------------

There is a restriction so it's not completely without restrictions:

#  Unicode, Inc. hereby grants the right to freely use the information
#  supplied in this file in the creation of products supporting the
#  Unicode Standard

Apache code doesn't have any such "field of use" restriction, if you will indulge my tying
this to "field of use".

My question is whether a restriction like this is enough to disqualify the license from being
in category A.

                
> Compatibility with Unicode License
> ----------------------------------
>
>                 Key: LEGAL-108
>                 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-108
>             Project: Legal Discuss
>          Issue Type: Question
>            Reporter: Mehdi Houshmand
>
> I was wondering if putting the file at the following URL would be compliant with the
ASF license?
> http://unicode.org/Public/MAPPINGS/VENDORS/ADOBE/stdenc.txt

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