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From Tim Ellison <t.p.elli...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: RandomGUID license compatibility
Date Tue, 21 Jul 2009 19:24:48 GMT
A few programs will do that to gain additional entropy, such as GnuGP
when generating keys.  I just use the contents of the members@ mailing
list digest -- more than enough randomness there for me :-)

Tim

On 21/Jul/2009 20:11, Lawrence Rosen wrote:
> I just used an application (I don't remember which, unfortunately) which
> told me to move the mouse around for a while and it used that data stream as
> a key for a random number generator. /Larry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ralph Goers [mailto:ralph.goers@dslextreme.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2009 8:26 AM
> To: legal-discuss@apache.org
> Subject: Re: RandomGUID license compatibility
> 
> I apologize as this isn't exactly on topic for this list, but we  
> recently had discussions about the various ways of creating "unique"  
> ids at work. None them generate truly unique ids, just ids with a very  
> low probability of reoccurance. We used to use code like that in the  
> link I mentioned but recently switched to java.util.UUID.randomUUID.  
> Frankly, my instinct tells me that the algorithm in RandomGUID is  
> actually better since it has a time component, machine component and a  
> decently large random component. Unfortunately, my math skills are too  
> rusty to calculate which is better, but I'd love to see an article on  
> that.
> 
> Ralph
> 
> On Jul 21, 2009, at 8:03 AM, Tim Ellison wrote:
> 
>> On 21/Jul/2009 15:42, Ralph Goers wrote:
>>> Did you get a response back regarding your concerns with the LGPL?   
>>> It
>>> is a bit odd to say that the code is OK because he intended to  
>>> license
>>> it under LGPL.
>>>
>>> The irony is that the code to create a UUID using an IP address,
>>> timestamp and random number would have taken less time than you have
>>> spent pursuing this. FWIW, this article from 2001 has much of the  
>>> needed
>>> code http://www.theserverside.com/patterns/thread.tss?thread_id=4976.
>> AIUI the RandomGUID is a securely random unique identifier, which is  
>> not
>> what is described in that article.
>>
>> If you just need universal uniqueness rather than randomly unique  
>> there
>> is an implementation of UUID in Apache Harmony
>>
>>
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/harmony/enhanced/classlib/trunk/modules/luni/sr
> c/main/java/java/util/UUID.java?view=co
>> Regards,
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>> On Jul 21, 2009, at 3:26 AM, Ross Gardler wrote:
>>>
>>>> 2009/7/20 Ross Gardler <rgardler@apache.org>:
>>>>> In doing the IP clearance for Wookie (Incubating) we came accross  
>>>>> the
>>>>> use of RandomGUID [1].
>>>> Below is a mail exchange with the author that indicates his  
>>>> intention
>>>> to allow the code to be used in any environment, including closed
>>>> source.
>>>>
>>>> I believe this is sufficient for us to proceed and will assume so
>>>> unless told otherwise here.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Ross
>>>>
>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>>> From: Ross Gardler <rgardler@apache.org>
>>>>> Date: 2009/7/21
>>>>> Subject: Re: License for RandomGUID
>>>>> To: marc.mnich@gmail.com
>>>>> Cc: wookie-dev@apache.org, private@roller.apache.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2009/7/21 Marc Mnich <marc.mnich@gmail.com>:
>>>>>> You may use this code for any purpose without having to make your
>>>>>> code open.
>>>>>> I do not believe in GPL for this reason and intended to release 

>>>>>> this
>>>>>> under
>>>>>> LGPL.
>>>>> LGPL would render it incompatible with the Apache Licence. If you  
>>>>> are
>>>>> happy with people reusing your code in any environment (including
>>>>> closed) then a permissive licence such as the BSD or the Apache
>>>>> Licence is your best choice.
>>>>>
>>>>>> As long as recognition is given somewhere, you are free in  
>>>>>> include in
>>>>>> your application without any other conditions.
>>>>> You can be assured of that.
>>>>>
>>>>>> I hope this helps and I am honored to be included in code for The
>>>>>> Apache
>>>>>> Software Foundation which I have used for many purposes for many
 
>>>>>> years.
>>>>>> Let me know if you need more clarification.
>>>>> I think that this email will be sufficient, I will confirm this  
>>>>> with
>>>>> the Apache legal-discuss list for archiving and will let you know  
>>>>> if
>>>>> we need anything more. It would be really helpful to others  
>>>>> wanting to
>>>>> reuse your code if you could place a note on your website and in  
>>>>> the
>>>>> code about the intended licence. If you are happy using the Apache
>>>>> Licence you can find details of how to do so at
>>>>> http://www.apache.org/dev/apply-license.html
>>>>>
>>>>> For your information the code is being used in Apache Wookie
>>>>> (Incubating) and Apache Roller. Thank you for your important
>>>>> contribution to these projects.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ross
>>>>>
>>>>>> Marc Mnich
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 20, 2009 at 6:32 PM, Ross Gardler  
>>>>>> <rgardler@apache.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Marc,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am working with a codebase that is entering The Apache Software
>>>>>>> Foundation. During our IP clearance for this code base we found
 
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> it includes your RandomGUID code from [1]. Unfortunately the
 
>>>>>>> licence
>>>>>>> for this code is not clear from your website.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wonder if you could indicate your intent with respect to  
>>>>>>> licensing
>>>>>>> of this code. Your site indicates the license for your other
 
>>>>>>> code is
>>>>>>> GPL, but I cannot find a similarly clear statement about  
>>>>>>> RandomGUID.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If your intention is to licence this code with the GPL this would
>>>>>>> render it incompatible with the Apache License and we would be
 
>>>>>>> unable
>>>>>>> to use it. Can you please let me know what licence your code
is
>>>>>>> available under.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> Ross
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [1] http://www.javaexchange.com/aboutRandomGUID.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>> Ross Gardler
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> OSS Watch - supporting open source in education and research
>>>>>>> http://www.oss-watch.ac.uk
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Ross Gardler
>>>>>
>>>>> OSS Watch - supporting open source in education and research
>>>>> http://www.oss-watch.ac.uk
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Ross Gardler
>>>>>
>>>>> OSS Watch - supporting open source in education and research
>>>>> http://www.oss-watch.ac.uk
>>>>>
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