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From Robert Burrell Donkin <rdon...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Topic-based mailing lists
Date Wed, 01 Apr 2009 07:52:30 GMT
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J Aaron Farr wrote:
> On Tue 31 Mar 2009 21:34, Henri Yandell <hyandell@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> Use community@ - if people get annoyed they'll voice that and the
>> correct context list can be created. Community gets used so rarely
>> that I don't have a filter for it, so there's nothing to complain
>> about yet and you're making make work.
> 
> +1 for using community@
> 
> general@jakarta used to be like that.  Some people loved it.  Some
> people didn't.  Personally, I think we as a foundation have lost
> "something" as Jakarta has disbanded.  A lively general discussion list
> is useful.  And members@ is too closed.

+1

IMHO there's a definitely feeling in the air that we lost - as well as
gained - when jakarta was disbanded, and that now's the time to start
doing something about it.

it didn't make sense to devote effort to this until  the new way was
bedded in. the incubator is now working ok (we need to complete the
documentation but i talked to a few people at apachecon, and we'll get
that done over the next few months).

i'm going to formally introduce this idea over on members in a few days,
but the idea i kicked around at ApacheCon was introducing a new
organisational unit ("a theme" - projects on the right and themes on the
left). the aim would be to be like the non-code part of Jakarta which
worked well as a spur to the development of serverside java.

this is basically an cross cut integration project and is only allowed
to talk (documentation, mailing lists, committers, PMC as per standard
projects but no code and no releases). so, it would have to work with
other projects to achieve it's goals. themes would also use the
incubator access rule (conventional access to PMC/committership for
members/committers, others by invitation).

themes would provide the members and the board with a vehicle for long
term, strategic plans spanning many projects. the initial worked example
would be "Apache Cloud" a hub and focus for cloud related activity
especially the tooling that's required across projects.

> The trouble with a general@ list is that it's hard to build a specific
> community there.  Just because there are occasional good threads about,
> say, osgi on a general@ list, why would a non-ASF committer subscribe to
> general@ instead of existing osgi specific mailing lists?
> 
> So I think you have to consider your goal:
> 
> If you want to create a public community for discussing a specific
> topic, then specific interest lists are appropriate, either here or
> outside the ASF, such as Google Groups.
>
> If you want to bounce ideas around other people already inside the ASF,
> then use a general list like community@.  You can always move the
> discussion elsewhere if necessary.

+1

i would like to suggest that we encourage PMCs to approach the board
with requests for general lists supervised by their PMC. for example,
ATM OSGi talk is starting to converge on felix but risks - in the long
term - drowning development work there. it would make sense to encourage
felix to be able to ask the board for permission to host a general OSGi
list for apache even though that's technically out of scope for the project.

- - robert

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