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From Shane Curcuru <...@shanecurcuru.org>
Subject Re: Community Guidelines (was Code of Conduct)
Date Mon, 02 Jul 2007 12:26:36 GMT


community-digest-help@apache.org wrote:
> From: J Aaron Farr <farra@apache.org>
> "Henri Yandell" <bayard@apache.org> writes:
> 
>> With "play nice", it's obvious that we're all interpreting things, but
>> with the attempted code of conduct there's an impression that it is
>> definitive and that I'm supposed to understand it all.
> 
> This is one of my concerns too.
> 
> Our culture is not a document; it's much more dynamic and diverse than
> even a wiki can handle.  That said, I'm all for recording expected
> behaviors and writing down some of our oral traditions.  I don't want
> to discourage Ted, or anyone else for that matter, on working on these
> sorts of efforts.  Let's just be clear that such documents are neither
> comprehensive nor binding.

I keep being surprised at the vehemence of feelings against writing 
down any sort of documentation that's non-technical.  (And I realize 
that this only includes the people who participate here; in my 
imagination there are several people who think this is such a dumb 
idea they won't even bother telling you).   It's unfortunate, because 
documents like this *really* help a significant percentage of our new 
and future contributors - even if some of our new contributors 
couldn't give a damn.

I keep thinking tweaking and publishing these guidelines linked from 
apache.org is one of those areas where we need to just do it, and 
those who don't like it need to get out of the way.  Obviously if you 
have a "this idea is fundamentally wrong and here is why" issue with 
it, that needs to be addressed.  But if you personally don't think the 
guidelines are useful, that's fine: many other people here think they are.

>> Slight side note. What's the punishment? Are we going to throw people
>> out of our community for breaking this? Are we only going to throw
>> them out if they sign up?
> 
> Another good point, Henri.

It's obvious what the punishment should be, isn't it? [1]

> Would it be more palatable if the page were renamed to something like
> "The Apache Way" or "By play nice we mean..." or "A couple of us wrote
> down how we think things work around here"?

Even I would object to calling it The Apache Way quite yet, since that 
is a tremendously loaded term with folks who have been here a while. 
I think this absolutely is well on it's way, but that particular term 
will result in more arguments than it's worth.  Will have to think 
about good titles - ones obvious that these guidelines are not 
restrictive, but are - I hate to use buzzwords - "best practices" for 
many Apache communities.

- Shane

[1] Ah, the joys of email, where you can't have the ironic look on 
your face when you say something designed to be purely humorous like that.

Man, I need some breakfast, because I'm usually not this harsh in 
emails.  Sorry.

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