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From Julie MacNaught <jma...@apache.org>
Subject [Fwd: [Fwd: OASIS]]
Date Wed, 07 Jul 2004 15:16:25 GMT
As I understand this, OASIS wants to grant Apache members (i.e. 
committers), the ability to join OASIS committees as if Apache were a 
member company.  This would be really handy for ASF committers who are 
either independent or work for a company that does not belong to OASIS.

This is a good thing for us (the ASF), and has no downside that I can 
see.  I agree that the collaborative working model for ASF projects is 
significantly different from OASIS projects, but that speaks to the 
nature of the problem.   Standards development is tough work and it 
requires a lot of direct collaboration (i.e. face-to-face or telecon) 
time to get issues worked out.  TCs are a lot of work, but it's 
important work. 

If an individual ASF committer is interested enough in the topic of an 
OASIS technical committee, presumbably with the intention of working on 
an implementation, then the individual committer will have to 
participate in telecons appropriately.   Attendance at face-to-face 
meetings is not required and a dial in number is normally provided. 

The WSRP4J and WSS4J are 2 projects off the top of my head that overlap 
with OASIS TCs.  I am an ASF committer on WSRP4J and a member of the 
WSRP OASIS Technical Committee as an observer.  I am sure there are 
quite of few ASF folk are also OASIS folk, but currently these can only 
be folk whose employer is an OASIS member.

We should make it as easy as possible to collaborate and participate 
with OASIS TCs so that we can use our extensive knowledge and experience 
to guide and influence standards that we plan to implement.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	[Fwd: OASIS]
Date: 	Fri, 02 Jul 2004 16:23:22 +0200
From: 	Santiago Gala PĂ©rez <sgala@hisitech.com>
Reply-To: 	Portals PMC <pmc@portals.apache.org>
To: 	pmc@portals.apache.org

The whole thread is about Apache joining Oasis, which could be relevant 
for wsrp4j and potentially other projects.


Dirk-Willem van Gulik <dirkx@webweaving.org>
Sun, 27 Jun 2004 20:09:42 +0200 (CEST)


Within the ASF we have a number of projects which deal with formats
and standards close to OASIS.

We've been approached by OASIS to see if it makes sense to join them. This
is a call out to Community to see if that makes sense.

There are a number of obstacles when working with OASIS (or the w3c for
that matter) compared to working with some of the other/normal standards
bodies such as the IETF.

Below are the obstacles to overcome/consider:

	->	Face 2 Face meetings and Telecons are important to them;
		as are forms of organisation bound voting alien to us.

		The ASF developers come from all walks of life; and while
		for some their ASF work is directly aligned with their normal
		jobs - for others it is not. Asynchronous email is crucial in
		allowing all to participate at times fitting; regardless of their
		timezone or other commitment. Hence any face to face travel,
		or significant teleconferencing requirements generally
		lower the quality of the ASF its participation.

	->	They have things like NDA and other agreements for
		their members, i.e. the ASF, which do not map onto
		the agreements the ASF has with its developers.

		We are a relatively open organisation; which makes
		it hard to adhere to NDA's or other embargo's as under
		normal operating procedures anyone can join any (mailing)
		list at any time; and their contributions are simply based
		on merit rather than as to wether they are a paying

	->	Any 'pay to play' is generally an issue for us on fundamental
		grounds. Even if a fee is waived - we generally insist that
		this is done not just for us - but for the entire open source,
		open standards and/or academic community at large.

But having said that - we've been able to resolve these issues in the
past with some other similar organisations.

So - community - do we see enough benefit to start this conversation with
Oasis ? Do we want to be close to some of their standards ?

I'll give this conversation a week or so to build up; and if not - will
send a polite msg to Oasis saying; thanks for the offer but not at this



Julie MacNaught
IBM Research

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