Return-Path: Mailing-List: contact community-help@apache.org; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list community@apache.org Received: (qmail 11260 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 05:29:29 -0000 Received: from mailout5-0.nyroc.rr.com (24.92.226.122) by daedalus.apache.org with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 05:29:29 -0000 Received: from pc13 (roc-24-93-14-71.rochester.rr.com [24.93.14.71]) by mailout5-0.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.6/RoadRunner 1.20) with SMTP id g9U5Tcc08881 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 00:29:39 -0500 (EST) From: Ted Husted To: community@apache.org Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 00:29:34 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Organization: Apache Softare Foundation - Jakarta Project In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Subject: Re: ASF Membership Nomination MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Mailer: Opera 6.05 build 1140 X-Spam-Rating: daedalus.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N 10/29/2002 11:23:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: >In terms of community fractures, I think the proposal to >promote Jakarta projects out of Jakarta [something I'm not >against] is the one that is a danger to the community. I think >this is why that community was originally defensive and still >hedgy. I think most of the edginess is simply fear of the unknown. Many of the ASF Members, like Greg, have not had the opportunity to interact with the ASF Committers working at Jakarta. Likewise, nearly all of us working at Jakarta have only interacted with a handful of the ASF Members. For good or ill, many of the key management lists at other ASF Projects are restricted, making it difficult for us to learn by example. Happily, this list is starting to fill that gap by documenting some of the missing usuage examples. =:0) I believe most of us are very eager to learn. Like many good developers, we are not eager to reinvent the wheel. Frameworks are a favorite topic at Jakarta, and I'm sure virtually all of us are ready, willing, and able to adopt the ASF framework. It's just most of us are still learning how the ASF architecture is suppose to work. Meanwhile, the Community at Jakarta is based on the interactions between its Committers, not on a political body or a URL. The Community of Committers that has arisen at Jakarta is not going to go away become some products "earn their stripe" and are promoted to top level projects. It's true that some people have developed a certain "brand" loyalty to Jakarta, but I think that loyalty will easily transfer back to Apache, as we learn more about what "being Apache" means. -Ted.