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From John Turner <tomcat-u...@johnturner.com>
Subject Re: [OT] best hardware config for Tomcat
Date Fri, 20 Jun 2003 14:01:15 GMT

Dual is just a preference.

If you are just going to be using it as an intranet server, with a given 
number of users, for a limited time period each day, I would just buy a 
desktop with 2 equal size disks and use RAID 1 mirroring.

John

On Fri, 20 Jun 2003 19:14:17 +0530, Antony <antonypaul24@hotmail.com> 
wrote:

> It is production server. I am a staff of the company where I have to 
> deploy
> the application. We will use the server only at office time. At most 12
> hours a day. After that shut it down. I dont know  what to name this kind 
> of
> machines. I want to run the machine to run 12 hours a day and overcome 
> the
> trouble of data loss. Any way u r mails have given me lots of insight. I
> think I have to learn more about hardware configurations. Why u r 
> suggesting
> dual processors ?. Can a dual processor system switch to a single 
> processor
> if one fails ?. Is there any bechmarks on hardware runningjava web
> applications ? If u suggest me any discussion forums or mailing lists 
> where
> I can ask this kind of questions I will not bother u with a silly 
> question.
>
> Thanks for the reply
> regards
> Antony
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Turner" <tomcat-user@johnturner.com>
> To: "Tomcat Users List" <tomcat-user@jakarta.apache.org>
> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 6:35 PM
> Subject: Re: [OT] best hardware config for Tomcat
>
>
>>
>> The biggest effect on Tomcat's performance will be the architecture and
>> design of your application.  You can buy the biggest fastest server in 
>> the
>> world, and have lousy performance if your application architecture is
> poor.
>>
>> If this is a production server, the absolute minimum I would consider 
>> for
>> "production", that is, for providing services that others pay me to
>> provide, and providing those services in such a way as to have the 
>> highest
>> uptime possible, is:
>>
>> Abs. minimum:
>> P3-1.4 GHz (dual absolutely preferred)
>> 1024 GB RAM
>> 2 36GB SCSI drives, RAID 1 (mirrored)
>> 100Mbps NIC
>>
>> Medium:
>> Dual P3-1.4GHz
>> 2GB RAM
>> 3 36GB SCSI drives, RAID 5 (2 + spare = 72GB usable)
>>
>> Better:
>> Dual P3-1.4 or higher
>> 4GB RAM
>> 3-5 36GB SCSI drives, RAID 5
>>
>> Still Better:
>> Dual P3-1.4 or higher
>> 6GB RAM
>> as much disk as you can provide
>>
>> Obviously, disk depends on how much you think you will need.  My servers
>> provide services to about 25 different clients.  Each has their own 
>> Tomcat
>> instance.  My servers are dual P3, 6GB RAM, 800GB-1TB disk in RAID-5 
>> with
>> parity and hot spare, dual everything (dual NIC, dual power supply, dual
>> fans, etc).
>>
>> Don't get bogged down in desktop PC terminology like DDR RAM, etc....for
>> servers that sort of stuff is irrelevant.  You want stability, not
>> speed...having the fastest CPU or the fastest RAM technology does you
>> nothing if your server keeps going down.  For servers (if you're serious
>> about it being a server), you want redundancy, parity and error-checking
>> and spares over everything else.  If it were up to me, I would take a
>> budget of X dollars and trade performance specs like MHz and GB for
>> redundancy, all day.  Drop back on CPU and RAM if it means you can get
> RAID
>> disk (hardware RAID is better than software RAID), redundant power
>> supplies, etc.  If all you are doing is looking to buy a desktop PC and
>> call it a server, then just buy whatever you want...it won't really
> matter,
>> and sooner or later your "server" will go down.
>>
>> Even then, pay attention to the architecture and design of your
>> application, and test it under load...that will make more of a 
>> difference
>> than jacking up some RAM or CPU hardware.
>>
>> John
>>
>> On Fri, 20 Jun 2003 18:04:34 +0530, Antony <antonypaul24@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Thanks for the reply. I had never thought of the RAID sub system. My
>> > situation is that there is no one I know to advice me in this regard 
>> and
>> > my
>> > company can't affod any highly paid consultancy. That is why asked a
>> > question like this here.
>> > Another question. Do Tomcat a requires a faster hard disk. The
>> > application uses JSP and Servlets only. No HTML pages are used and it
>> > generates some PDF and Excel files. It also serves some small images
>> > files
>> > from local hard disk. I think Tomcat will cache these images. Now my
>> > concern
>> > is  whether Tomcat's performance increases by faster DDR RAM.
>> >
>> > regards Antony
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "John Turner" <tomcat-user@johnturner.com>
>> > To: "Tomcat Users List" <tomcat-user@jakarta.apache.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 6:09 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [OT] best hardware config for Tomcat
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> I won't get into specifics, but I can tell you that if you are 
>> planning
>> >> to
>> >> put this server into production, and run Oracle on it, a single hard
>> >> disk
>> >> is the WORST thing you can do, for a whole range of reasons.
>> >>
>> >> In most cases, CPU and RAM are not bottlenecks...disk is.  When in
>> >> doubt,
>> >> get more and faster disk, even if it means less RAM and less CPU.
>> >>
>> >> At a minimum you will want RAID 1...better yet, two systems disks
>> >> mirrored
>> >> with RAID 1 containing your OS and systems files, and then a RAID 5
>> >> array
>> >> for Oracle.
>> >>
>> >> I strongly suggest you consult a professional.  Do not try to spec 
>> this
>> > out
>> >> on your own, it is clear that you are not familiar on some key points
> of
>> >> hardware provisioning.  This isn't bad, I am just suggesting that you
>> >> should find someone who is familiar, and will recommend an adequate
>> >> system
>> >> for you.  Making the wrong decision now could harm your efforts in 
>> the
>> >> future.
>> >>
>> >> If you're planning on putting this server into production, and 
>> selling
>> >> the
>> >> services on this server to other people, it would be unethical to 
>> make
>> >> promises about uptime and reliability unless you at least have a RAID
>> >> array, redundant power supplies, a 4-hour window service contract, 
>> and
>> >> preferably a duplicate system for hot backup.
>> >>
>> >> John
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, 19 Jun 2003 12:25:47 +0530, Antony <antonypaul24@hotmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Hi all,
>> >> > If it is not the place to ask this question forgive me Please any 
>> one
>> >> > tell me a place to ask this question.
>> >> > I want to know the most suitable hardware configuration for Tomcat.
> We
>> >> > have to run both Tomcat and Oracle 8i on it. It  is business(
> intranet
>> >> )
>> >> > application with about 10 users accessing at starting but planning

>> to
>> >> > take
>> >> > it to 60 users in future. Then we can increase the RAM to 
>> accommodate
>> > new
>> >> > users. I assume by increasing RAM we Tomcat can service more users.
> Am
>> >> I
>> >> > right ?
>> >> > I am not an admin or hardware expert. We plan to buy an assembled
>> >> > system. We can afford only Intel based system. I have several
>> >> questions.
>> >> > Do
>> >> > Tomcat need the processing power of dual processor PIV or single 
>> Xeon
>> >> > processor ?. What kind of memory shall I use SDRAM or DDR ?  Do
> Tomcat
>> >> > need
>> >> > large amount of memory or high speed memory ?.We plan to use a 
>> single
>> >> > hard
>> >> > disk. What type of hard disk is best for this configuration ?. SCSI
> or
>> >> > IDE ?
>> >> > When I lloked at the Intel site I have seen different categories 
>> like
>> >> > server,mainstream ,work station, performance etc. Remember I can't
>> >> > recommend
>> >> > any latest high cost technology.
>> >> > At present three developers are using a single Pentium 4 based 
>> system
>> >> > with 512 MB of SDRAM with Oracle and Tomcat running. It runs fine 
>> in
>> >> it.
>> >> > We
>> >> > dont have conducted any stress test on it. We dont know to use 
>> JMeter
>> >> or
>> >> > something else. I have to give the config details within 2 days.
>> >> > Any comments will be apprecited.
>> >> >
>> >> > Regars
>> >> > Antony.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------

>>
>>
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>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
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