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From "Affan Qureshi" <>
Subject Re: <If> STRUTS</If>
Date Thu, 10 Apr 2003 09:40:40 GMT

> Thanks all for your comment.
> No doubt in my mind that Struts is better to use than unstructured JSP.
> There are couple things in my mind though:
> 1) Can I create MVC app without using Struts, such as separate my logic
> out from the JSP (I know, there was an example that show there are cases
> using struts reduce the code down dramatically, so this lead to a 2nd
> question)

Yes you can. The basic idea is to have a central controller in place and
seperation of business model and the view. So you can implement it any way
you like. Of course Struts has done it the way its founders found best using
the experience out there. Take a look at WebWork too. You might find less
API to learn.

I think if you are developing any serious application you might find
yourself developing a framework something like Struts why why not use Struts

> 2) With the complicated web nature, and the complicated Struts (with my
> thought on the first post), isn't there some room for easier to learn,
> and quicker to adopt technology than Struts (Which may not exist yet).
> This question is silly by itself, but please give me time to explain.
> What I try to ask is that is there a currently existed technology that
> is much better than struts, or is it very forseeable that such a
> technology can be develope in a near future.  (Sure, Struts is not
> perfect, and can be improved, but I am talking a big change, not an
> improvement here).

Struts may seem just as complicated as you want it to be. Just like EJBs and
other J2EE stuff. I agree that you should have a reasonable servlet/jsp
background to use Struts but you can use what you want from it and ignore
the rest. Struts provides ways to implement the most commonly used features
in webapps. Look at "How Struts Works" article on the Struts website.

> 3) Can you give me a good example of use for Struts?
> My list of guesses (please comment on each, and give extra if you have

Struts does not build apps. Nor does it have components to build apps. You
have to create the apps yourself. It just assists you in handling some of
the common web application tasks more easily so that you don't start from
scratch everytime. You still have to write the application modules (mail
manager, shopping cart processor, CRM modules, game engine, etc.). The real
application is what you write not Struts. Although a lot of components and
plugins are available which might make frequently used features available

All the examples you listed can be done even with JSP or even servlets for
that matter. The problem is to reduce complexity and increase productivity.

> a) The follow can be easily done by JSP without Struts:
>     - Reservation system web app?
>     - Email app (such hotmail)?
>     - Shopping cart?
>     - Corporate website (such as customer support area).
> b) No, the above are too simple:
>     - Nuclear explotion simmulation (or extraterrestrial life search)
>     - Multi player (webase) app (like dungeon type, or sim)
>     - Webase collaboration (such as 1000 people working on a same
> c) No, it's the ability to easily add GUI functionality to IDE that
> generates Struts apps
> d) It depends on  how the app works:
>     - Application that uses alot of sessionings
>     - Application that uses alot of customization (personalization)
>     - Application that changes all the time (like a news service such as
>     - Application that is extremely large, and structural (not a list of
> 1000 pages, but 1000 pages structurally, and display depends on the
> current state).
>     - Application that is highly interactive (with users)
>     - Application that was moved from desktop client to the web client.
> Please don't say all of the above, because I know Struts can do all
> that.  Just the one that makes Struts a big differentiator.
> Again, thanks all.  If you have time, please share.  If not, please
> ignore.  I know, I just want to discuss ideas, and learn a bit from your
> experience.   You can always ask me to search for the information on the
> web.  But getting information interactively from people who knows it
> best is something I don't like to pass up.



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