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From "Bill Barker" <>
Subject Re: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction
Date Thu, 06 Feb 2003 08:40:24 GMT

"Will Hartung" <> wrote in message
> > From: "Denise Mangano" <>
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 5:16 PM
> > Subject: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction
> > Seeing as how I am going to be doing the web dev part, while the others
> deal
> > with the complex database structure and project management tasks, I am
> > trying to sell them on using JSP/Tomcat.  They are insisting on using
> > scripts, which I personally feel is too fundamental for the task at
> Tell them that it's 2003 and not 1995. WebApps as a class of applications
> have matured, and there are entire bookcases written on the topic at your
> local Barnes and Nobles bookstore. I can't fathom anybody who wanted any
> project of any moderate complexity doing it in straight CGI.

Back in 1995, I was supervising a CGI-based webapp (now extinct).  Since
then, I have never recommended using CGI as a webapp protocol.  Even
JServ+Servlet 2.0+JDK 1.1.x was an improvement.

> This is not a CGI vs JSP topic, it's a CGI vs Modern WebApp Framework
> Whether it's JSP, PHP, ASP, or any of a plethora of other platforms.
> CGI is still quite valuable and viable for small utilities and what not,
> particularly for the small web hosts that "only allow CGI".
> But, if it's not a deployment requirement, then I'd run away screaming and
> latch on to ANY of the modern web app architectures and just cling tight
> screaming "NO NO NO" as they tried to peal it out of my clenched fists.
> There are simply too many wheels to reinvent.
> JSPs are valuable because of the infrastructure that the Servlet container
> provides. Portability across web servers, and platforms. "Free"
> authentication, "Free" session management, "Free" filtering, all easily
> configurable with no code changes.
> I'm not going to go into the highs and lows of JSPs themselves. The
> advantage of JSPs, IMHO, are that they're Just Servlets. Servlets rock, I
> think it's a great architecture that has tremendous potential, as shown by
> the abundance of frameworks built on top of the basic functionality that
> Servlets provide.
> With Servlets and JSPs, you can write the most horrible code on the planet
> and be ridiculed by knowledgable coders world wide (even if your site
> fine for you), but you can also write some very elegant code. And the best
> part, is that you can write crappy code on top of your elegant code when
> time crunches hit.
> Anyway, it's the architecture that you get for "Free" that makes this a
> platform choice. Add in the zillions of lines of 3rd party code out there
> and I think it's one of the most flexible platforms for web applications
> the market.
> Regards,
> Will Hartung
> (

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