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From Denise Mangano <>
Subject RE: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction
Date Thu, 06 Feb 2003 06:11:39 GMT
Wow.  Thank you all so much for responding to this question.  Its getting
quite frustrating hearing them saying CGI CGI CGI...  especially since they
are looking for a 'quick' solution and haven't done any research to the
advantages/disadvantages of using one technology over the other.

This project is to design a system that will one day (hopefully) be
implemented in one of the largest hospitals in the area.  This is definitely
not child's play - it will not only be important for this project to be
maintainable, but also to be expandable to meet the growing needs of the
client.  Personally, when I think CGI, I think of some rinky dink site that
people put up to sell the useless items collecting dust at home.  Forgive me
if I am offending anyone, I am sure that CGI does have its good qualities...
PHP was suggested but the ones who were adamant about CGI tossed that out
the window... I would rather have to struggle through learning PHP then to
use CGI!

Well, as I said, thank you thank you thank you... I will look at the site
you found on Google, and I will use everything you have all said to support
my argument. I just hope its an argument I can win, because I would love
this opportunity, but personally I don't think I would want to be part of a
team that would take an important project so lightly as to use whatever
technology they feel is 'easiest' and deliver that to the client.

Thanks and wish me luck :)

P.S. As for my work project, things are running quite smoothly and we are
almost ready to go live - thank you to EVERYONE that helped me through all
the obstacles!!!

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Sheehan
To: Tomcat Users List
Sent: 2/5/2003 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction

Good answer.

Did anyone forward this to Denise, the original author of the question?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Will Hartung" <>
To: "Tomcat Users List" <>
Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 8:07 PM
Subject: Re: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction

> > From: "Denise Mangano" <>
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 5:16 PM
> > Subject: [OT]JSP defense - can you point me in the right direction
> > Seeing as how I am going to be doing the web dev part, while the
> deal
> > with the complex database structure and project management tasks, I
> > trying to sell them on using JSP/Tomcat.  They are insisting on
> > scripts, which I personally feel is too fundamental for the task at
> Tell them that it's 2003 and not 1995. WebApps as a class of
> have matured, and there are entire bookcases written on the topic at
> local Barnes and Nobles bookstore. I can't fathom anybody who wanted
> project of any moderate complexity doing it in straight CGI.
> This is not a CGI vs JSP topic, it's a CGI vs Modern WebApp Framework
> Whether it's JSP, PHP, ASP, or any of a plethora of other platforms.
> CGI is still quite valuable and viable for small utilities and what
> particularly for the small web hosts that "only allow CGI".
> But, if it's not a deployment requirement, then I'd run away screaming
> latch on to ANY of the modern web app architectures and just cling
> screaming "NO NO NO" as they tried to peal it out of my clenched
> There are simply too many wheels to reinvent.
> JSPs are valuable because of the infrastructure that the Servlet
> provides. Portability across web servers, and platforms. "Free"
> authentication, "Free" session management, "Free" filtering, all
> configurable with no code changes.
> I'm not going to go into the highs and lows of JSPs themselves. The
> advantage of JSPs, IMHO, are that they're Just Servlets. Servlets
rock, I
> think it's a great architecture that has tremendous potential, as
shown by
> the abundance of frameworks built on top of the basic functionality
> Servlets provide.
> With Servlets and JSPs, you can write the most horrible code on the
> and be ridiculed by knowledgable coders world wide (even if your site
> fine for you), but you can also write some very elegant code. And the
> part, is that you can write crappy code on top of your elegant code
> time crunches hit.
> Anyway, it's the architecture that you get for "Free" that makes this
> platform choice. Add in the zillions of lines of 3rd party code out
> and I think it's one of the most flexible platforms for web
> the market.
> Regards,
> Will Hartung
> (
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