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From Konstantin Preißer <verlag.preis...@t-online.de>
Subject RE: svn commit: r1521594 [1/16] - in /tomcat/site/trunk: docs/ docs/images/ docs/stylesheets/ xdocs/images/ xdocs/stylesheets/
Date Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:17:02 GMT
Hi,

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Schultz [mailto:chris@christopherschultz.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 6:42 PM
> >
> > 1. All those <header><footer> are only marginally better than <div>.
> > Keep it simple.

The HTML5 spec introduced those elements (header, footer, nav) so that authors are able to
use a better mark-up in their pages. E.g. a screen reader is able to only read the relevant
content and not navigation, header, footer and so on which is the same on every page.
When improving the HTML markup, I tried to orientate on the current specification. I do not
see why we shouldn't use it.

> >
> > I do not like the use of conditional comments.

OK. I think I will replace them with workarounds that work also for old Firefoxes (3.x) (see
below).

> > 2. Not every server is connected to the internet and is kept
> > up-to-date to have the latest Firefox.  I have to maintain Tomcat on
> > several servers that have old version of Firefox installed (such as
> > 3.6). This documentation will be broken there. [3]
> > (Well, it is not a show stopper. It would be a lot more trouble if we
> > broke the Manager application).
> >
> > IIRC, the plan was to roll this design to Tomcat 7 and Tomcat 6 as well.

We can also think about leaving the Tomcat 6 and 7 docs with the old markup.

However, the problem with Firefox 3.x is that it does not have the "display: block" style
on elements such as header etc. A good way to solve this should be to place a div inside of
such a element and apply CSS there, e.g. "<header><div style="...">". I will propose
a patch for this change on Bugzilla.

> Since we have XSLT at our disposal, I propose that we:
> 
> a) leave <header> and some of the more exotic HTML5 elements in place in
> the source.
> 
> b) have the transformer convert <header> into <div> for the time being.
> At some point in the future, we can remove that substitution.

I don't think this is necesssary with the change to apply CSS to a <div> instead of
a <header> mentioned above. Browser that do not support <header> will just treat
it like a <span> (well, except for IE 8 and older; therefore moving the CSS from <header>
to <div>).

> If I've got it wrong, and the XSLT is the problem (because it converts
> <section> into <header> instead of <div>), well then it's just a
> one-step process: change the XSLT to use <div> instead of <header> and
> be done with it.
> 
> I like the "proper" markup of <header>, etc. because it gives the
> document more semantic structure than all those <divs> (one of the
> downfalls of HTML DOM standardization is that everyone switched
> everything over to DIV). On the other hand, there are <h1> through <h6>,
> so if you want a <header>, why not use <hN> instead?

<hN> is used for marking a header on a section, but <header> markes a part of
the page as not being main content (e.g. the Tomcat logo and Apache feather which stays the
same on every .HTML page).


Regards,
Konstantin Preißer


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