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From "Frank W. Zammetti" <fzli...@omnytex.com>
Subject Re: Persistent "xmlValidation" Problem
Date Fri, 04 Nov 2005 04:53:51 GMT
I'm just guessing here, and maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think this post 
is going to get you a whole lot of help in answering your questions.

Maybe it will, I don't know, but I'm thinking not.

Frank

Bob Bronson wrote:
> Comments below, for any of you who care....
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeanfrancois Arcand" 
> <jfarcand@apache.org>
> To: "Tomcat Developers List" <dev@tomcat.apache.org>
> Cc: <tomcat-dev@jakarta.apache.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 9:11 AM
> Subject: Re: Persistent "xmlValidation" Problem
> 
> 
>> Hi,
>>
>> Bob Bronson wrote:
>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> Sorry, to bother the developer group with this question but I posted 
>>> twice on the user group and received zero replies. I was hoping one 
>>> of you could offer some quick advice on this question.
>>> ---------------------------------
>>> I'm using TC 5.5.12.
>>> Please look at this snippet from the server.xml that is distributed
>>> with TC:
>>>
>>>  <!-- Define the default virtual host
>>>        Note: XML Schema validation will not work with Xerces 2.2.
>>>    -->
>>>   <Host name="localhost" appBase="webapps"
>>>    unpackWARs="true" autoDeploy="true"
>>>    xmlValidation="false" xmlNamespaceAware="false">
>>>
>>>
>>> Can anyone tell me what the 'xmlValidation' attribute on <Host> is for?
>>> I realize it has something to do with "XML validation", but what XML is
>>> it referring to? Is it the corresponding web.xml?
>>
>>
>> Yes it is.
>>
>> And how does the
>>
>>> 'xmlNamespaceAware' attribute fit in?
>>
>>
>> You can decide to validate with or without namespace.
>>
>>>
>>> And what's the comment about the Xerces 2.2 parser?
>>
>>
>> For a long time, Xerces was broken/buggy when used in Tomcat.
>>
>> 'm using Sun's JDK
>>
>>> 1.5.0. Does it use Xerces internally?
>>
>>
>> Yes it does.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the mostly useless reply. I was hoping (silly me) that since
> the 'xmlValidation' attribute is completely undocumented
> (http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/config/host.html), one of the
> Tomcat programmers could go into more detail about whether it works and
> any sublties involved in its use (e.g., any JDK dependecies). Setting
> it to 'true' results in a lot of stack traces when validating my simple
> web.xml.
> 
> Here's something that illustrates the sloppiness of Tomcat programmers:
> 
> I installed a fresh copy of TC 5.5.12 (using JDK 1.5.0 on Win XP). I
> went into the server.xml that is distributed with TC and changed the
> 'xmlValidation' attribute value to "true" on the <Host> attribute. What
> do you think happened? I got tons of meaningless stack traces. This
> tells me one of two things -- either the sloppy Tomcat open sores
> programmers released an invalid web.xml that doesn't validate *OR* that
> the 'xmlValidation' functionality is broken.
> 
> The fact that Tomcat 5.5.12 was released with this very basic (admit
> it, it's not a subtle issue) problem indicates to me the poor state of
> testing the Tomcat programmers must do at a system level.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>>
>>>
>>> When I set the 'xmlValidation' attribute to 'true' I get a big stack
>>> trace. One would think it might be appropriate to offer a nice error
>>> message describing the problem.
>>
>>
>> Blame Xerces ;-). XML error are not always easy to discover.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You say that the lousy XML error messages are something I should "blame
> on Xerces". That response is a lazy copout which is *SO TYPICAL* of the
> arrogant programmers working on open sores projects. I don't blame the
> error messages on Xerces, I blame them on lazy, sloppy open sores
> Tomcat programmers -- too lazy to test even basic aspects of their
> system (like XML validation), too lazy to keep the documentation of
> their product up to date, too lazy to GENERATE VALID, MEANINGFUL ERROR
> MESSAGES rather than just dumping a stack trace from Xerces, too lazy
> to look into any problems that don't interest them. (Hey, they're not
> getting paid, why should they bother with things that don't interest
> them? -- That seems to be the Open Source Programmer's Manifesto).
> 
> 
> 
> 
>>>
>>> I've looked at the latest TC documentation for <Host> and it makes no
>>> mention of the 'xmlValidation' attribute:
>>> http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/config/host.html
>>
>>
>> That's a problem. I will take a look.
>>
>>>
>>> Can someone please explain these two attributes? My web.xml is getting
>>> unwieldy and I'd like to start validating it.
>>
>>
>> In short, set those two values to true. If you are seeing exception, 
>> then it means your web.xml is not properly written. Try using 
>> Netbeans/Eclipse (or any IDE). It is much more easy.
>>
> 
> 
> Another lazy copout!! Even the web.xml that is distributed w/Tomcat
> does not validate! Did you even test this before you replied to my note
> or did you just assume the user was at fault???
> 
> 
> When someone criticizes the poor state of an open sores project (as I
> am doing now), the typical response from the open sores programmer is
> to shift responsibility to the user -- the user is often told to dig
> through the change logs or browse the forum archives or even to fix the
> bug/documentation themselves instead of "complaining". What an
> unprofessional, lazy attitude from programmers! The open sores
> programmers try to cast *their* laziness as the user's laziness for
> "not digging deeply enough" to resolve their own problem, or even
> fixing the problem themselves by going into the source code. The fact
> that the Tomcat User mailing list often receives over 150 messages a
> day is more a testament to Tomcat's crappy documentation than to its
> popularity.
> 
> Yes, yes, I know Tomcat is "not for me". You're damned right. I'm happy
> to pay money for quality. I guess Tomcat bares out the old adage, "you
> get what you pay for".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 

-- 
Frank W. Zammetti
Founder and Chief Software Architect
Omnytex Technologies
http://www.omnytex.com
AIM: fzammetti
Yahoo: fzammetti
MSN: fzammetti@hotmail.com

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