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From "Pier P. Fumagalli" <>
Subject Re: Fuck It.
Date Thu, 21 Dec 2000 21:30:26 GMT
Christopher Cain wrote:
> "Pier P. Fumagalli" wrote:
> > Where were you KIDS when we were fighting the big
> > corporations to have them looking into open source, to contribute
> > significant parts of their technologies to the Foundation, where were you
> > while we were changing this world? You were home, and one day, you looked up
> > on your browser, saw a thing called Jakarta and started weening if things
> > weren't as nice as you wanted them.
> Nice. Now as a newcomer who wishes to give back to the community, do you think
> that this makes me feel more welcome or less? Why don't you just post a big sign
> that says, "If you were not here in the beginning, you are irrelevent. Go Away."
> That would probably be a slightly more effective means of keeping new developers
> away than simply making fun of them.

That was not my intent, sometimes I just get too epic :) :) :)
What I wanted to say is that when decisions are made, even if in an open
source project, you have to stick with them. That's why new developers
are "hinted" to read the list for a while before coming along and trying
to revolution the whole thing.

> I assume that I fall under that auspise since I also called Jon out directly. And
> yes, as I stated in no uncertain terms, many times I do _not_ care about reading
> what Jon writes. Many of his posts are so demeaning to whomever they addressed
> that it is difficult to read them all the way through, quite literally. It makes
> me uncomfortable to see well-meaning people treated like that. And trust me, I
> received enough private mail on the subject to assure you that I am far from the
> only one. The bottom line is, Jon is currently getting no more and no less than
> he gives everyone else.

And that's wrong... Why sending you email privately? Come on out, my old
flameproof vest is on, and kids, you don't even know how much I can
Get out, tell me I'm an ignorant idiot (Duncan, what was that? Arrogant
Pig? I believe that's how you've been called somewhere else! :) :)

All I ask you guys it to prove me wrong. Prove me that 3.3 is not a new
servlet container, prove me that it's just bugfix and performance. Give
me some damn facts.

> > hear that people like Paul Frieden (the only person that did put some salt
> > in what he said)
> Hey, thanks =)
> <technical arguments/replies snipped due to my position as a whining, snot-nosed
> little kiddie who stumbled across Jakarta a mere six months ago and can therefore
> not possibly have anything meaningful to say>

Did I overlook one of your emails? Subject please, since you posted 6
times on this mailing list and the first time in september. Were you
around when 4.0 was voted on? 

> > As one of the people behind the scenes since before each of you got here, I
> > believe my vote counts, and now, please prove me wrong.
> This post is a better example of my original point than I could possibly dream
> up, and it has nothing to do with the technical merits of the architecture. Sam
> is right on the money. Do you think that this little scuttle over 3.x vs. 4.x
> will be too terribly important six months from now? Probably not. What will be is
> the one or two or ten developers who eventually decided to contribute their
> limited time and resources to a different OSS project because this one is getting
> too contentious for their tastes. There are other great projects out there to get
> involved in, and whether or not a project has some fun people to work with, as
> opposed to everyone treating each other like shit when they disagree, is
> definitely a consideration for most of us.

Go back, read the archives and take a look to what I said when we voted
on tomcat 4.0. Then go again and read what I proposed Costin for his new
servlet container.

Cute, now I'm the bad guy. I like this position... You still didn't
proove me wrong.


Pier Fumagalli <> <>

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