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From Stefano Mazzocchi <>
Subject Re: open processes...
Date Wed, 05 Jan 2000 12:24:42 GMT
Ben Laurie wrote:
> James Todd wrote:
> >
> > "Craig R. McClanahan" wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > * When the first public drafts of a new specification are released, there
> > >   is usually no hint of all the back room discussions, and rejected design
> > >   choices, that went on before that release occurred.  Unfortunately, this
> > >   sometimes leaves people wondering "why in the heck did they choose
> > >   THAT approach," and can lead to the (usually mistaken) conclusion that
> > >   no other alternative was considered.
> >
> > this one ranks pretty high in my book. while it is possible to build an
> > implementation
> > with nothing but a spec in hand it would be extremely helpful to see the
> > formulating thoughts and discussions that went into the decission making process.
> Which leads one to wonder why things aren't done in the IETF WG way
> (i.e. working groups are open to all comers). Because the only way you
> are ever going to get access to the thoughts and discussions is by full
> disclosure, and if you are going to do that, you may as well let people
> join in before it is too late.

I could not agree more with this.

I don't like the fact that you have to sign up a non-discosure-agreement
when you enter those JCP committees. The Servlet API Expert Group is the
only one that didn't and, IMO, it showed Sun the power of this. Too bad,
they think specs are company-driven rather than individuals-driven.

I don't want to be unfriendly. I am too impressed by the work done in
Sun and you guys know how much I respect what you have done in the past,
but it's not enough.

Sun is going slowly into the dark side of community unfriendlyness. Can
Sun afford this? I think not.

Sun has moved away from ISO, now is moving away from ECMA. People are
questioning the evolution of the Java platform. I'm one of them.

DoX-Mozilla-Status: 0009standard is their own? fine, I have no problems
with de-facto standards with no ISO/ECMA labels on top, but let
_everyone_ being involved into it.

Ben is totally right, the IETF process has shown it's ability to stand
evolution, technology challenges, commercial challenges and so forth.
The internet is what it is because of the openess of the IETF process,
no more, no less.

Do you want Java to become the standard platform for programming as much
as the internet has become the standard platform for networking? open up
its evolution processes.

Or Sun will just become the next M$.

Stefano Mazzocchi      One must still have chaos in oneself to be
                          able to give birth to a dancing star.
<>                             Friedrich Nietzsche
 Come to the first official Apache Software Foundation Conference!  
------------------------- http://ApacheCon.Com ---------------------

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