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Message-ID: <20060325235731.6363.qmail@web32601.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2006 15:57:31 -0800 (PST)
From: Paul Benedict <paul4christ79@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [FRIDAY] Re: has struts reached the saturation
To: Struts Users Mailing List <user@struts.apache.org>
In-Reply-To: <e03014300603251550k8022806wcf7d7dd2daccd17f@mail.gmail.com>
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Dakota,

Thanks for wanting my input :-) I am not looking for censorship,
but I am looking for productive discussions and sometimes that means
pruning one discussion for the sake of another. I tend to agree that
this thread should move onto the dev board; it seems to be the appropraite
place, in my eyes, for discussion on project management, patches, and
the future vision of Struts. I don't think it is a difficult thing
to transpose these discussions there, so, if probably will hold off on this
thread until it moves over. I just don't want to penalize true user
questions here, since some people need real development help, and I think
having a ton of philosophical inbound mail detracts from it.

Paul

--- Dakota Jack <dakota.jack@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, I for one would be interested in what you have to say, Paul.  I think
> it is too bad that you feel you cannot answer on this list.  That is as
> close to a tragedy as it gets.  I cannot believe how censorship works on
> this list.  What a sad thing.  I want to get peoples' ideas on this.  I
> cannot get them if this list is afraid to talk because Craig comes on and
> says "shut up".  Nothing could be more relevant to this community than why
> it failed.  To suggest otherwise is either disingenuous or facist or both.
> 
> On 3/25/06, Paul Benedict <paul4christ79@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Johnathan,
> >
> > I am going to eat my own advice. I am going to respond
> > to this privately :) Expect an email soon.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > --- Jonathan Revusky <revusky@wanadoo.es> wrote:
> >
> > > Paul Benedict wrote:
> > > > +1 with Frank and Craig. Unless you need to have your viewpoint
> > > > continuously heard in public, some of the latter postings can be
> > > > shared privately. Most of it was good, and I think it generated
> > > > much good; thanks for sharing.
> > >
> > > Well, my problem on this right now is that I just don't have closure.
> > >
> > > I asked the basic question of why Struts development stagnated and
> > > people who really should have by now really grappled with this question
> > > and considered it, simply disengaged, and some even started with the
> > > insults and such.
> > >
> > > I don't really like putting you on the spot, Paul (with other people, I
> > > don't mind so much but you seem like a basically okay guy) but I'm just
> > > going to ask you the same question I asked a whole bunch of other people
> > > and never got any answer from.
> > >
> > > What, in your opinion, are the reasons that Struts development
> > stagnated?
> > >
> > > I know I'm being a hard-nosed SOB but I also know that the question is
> > > well-formulated, valid, and broadly on-topic for a Struts list.
> > >
> > > I'm sure you have an opinion on this subject, Paul. If you won't share
> > > your views, I'd be curious as to why. You see, I'm developing the
> > > impression that the above question is basically taboo somehow.
> > >
> > > Once you pose this question, people just start coming out of the
> > > woodwork screaming at you to shut up and stuff. So, at this point, I
> > > pretty much have developed a morbid fascination and am inclined to
> > > simply ask the question to everybody and see how they react. :-) So now
> > > I am asking you... :-)
> > >
> > > Jonathan Revusky
> > > --
> > > lead developer, FreeMarker project, http://freemarker.org/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > --- "Frank W. Zammetti" <fzlists@omnytex.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>Craig McClanahan wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>>No matter where the conversation developed, it has gone in directions
> > that
> > > >>>are off topic on this list.  Please feel free to continue the
> > conversation,
> > > >>>but do it somewhere else.
> > > >>
> > > >>(About to break my own "I'm done posting in this thread" rule)...
> > > >>
> > > >>Even I, as someone who was knee-deep in this thread for a while, agree
> > > >>with Craig.  The problem is it was a discussion for a while, but has
> > > >>become people just talking over one another now.
> > > >>
> > > >>I'm all for people expressing their viewpoints, no matter how
> > unpopular,
> > > >>but at some point it becomes obvious that no one is listening to one
> > > >>another, and then it's an exercise in futility.
> > > >>
> > > >>No one can stop anyone else from posting, not without locking someone
> > > >>out from the list anyway, which I hope never happens to anyone, but at
> > > >>some point everyone has to come to the realization that the
> > conversation
> > > >>has past the point of being useful in any real way.  If no one's
> > opinion
> > > >>was changed 30 posts ago, chances are it's not going to happen now.
> > > >>
> > > >>Besides, if the points being raised are valid at all, this thread
> > won't
> > > >>be the last of its kind...  Someone will at some point start another
> > and
> > > >>it'll all come out again, so why not hold back some of the talking
> > > >>points for next time? ;)
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>Craig
> > > >>
> > > >>Frank
> > > >>
> > > >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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> >
> >
> 
> 
> --
> "You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
> ~Dakota Jack~
> 


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