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From "Dakota Jack" <dakota.j...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [FRIDAY] Re: has struts reached the saturation
Date Sun, 26 Mar 2006 00:01:33 GMT
I don't know about you, but my email comes organized so that I can easily
work around anything that happens on a list.  I would think that this is
fairly normal and something we could expect?  I can remember when the dev
list would say "Heh, take that stuff to the user list".  But, if things go
to the dev list I am "down with that".  I really think that this is an
important topic.  A lot of talent is not going to get hooked into Struts, as
it has not in the past, if we continue that way things are.  I am
interested, by the way, in everyone's input.

On 3/25/06, Paul Benedict <paul4christ79@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Dakota,
>
> Thanks for wanting my input :-) I am not looking for censorship,
> but I am looking for productive discussions and sometimes that means
> pruning one discussion for the sake of another. I tend to agree that
> this thread should move onto the dev board; it seems to be the appropraite
> place, in my eyes, for discussion on project management, patches, and
> the future vision of Struts. I don't think it is a difficult thing
> to transpose these discussions there, so, if probably will hold off on
> this
> thread until it moves over. I just don't want to penalize true user
> questions here, since some people need real development help, and I think
> having a ton of philosophical inbound mail detracts from it.
>
> Paul
>
> --- Dakota Jack <dakota.jack@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Well, I for one would be interested in what you have to say, Paul.  I
> think
> > it is too bad that you feel you cannot answer on this list.  That is as
> > close to a tragedy as it gets.  I cannot believe how censorship works on
> > this list.  What a sad thing.  I want to get peoples' ideas on this.  I
> > cannot get them if this list is afraid to talk because Craig comes on
> and
> > says "shut up".  Nothing could be more relevant to this community than
> why
> > it failed.  To suggest otherwise is either disingenuous or facist or
> both.
> >
> > On 3/25/06, Paul Benedict <paul4christ79@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Johnathan,
> > >
> > > I am going to eat my own advice. I am going to respond
> > > to this privately :) Expect an email soon.
> > >
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > --- Jonathan Revusky <revusky@wanadoo.es> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Paul Benedict wrote:
> > > > > +1 with Frank and Craig. Unless you need to have your viewpoint
> > > > > continuously heard in public, some of the latter postings can be
> > > > > shared privately. Most of it was good, and I think it generated
> > > > > much good; thanks for sharing.
> > > >
> > > > Well, my problem on this right now is that I just don't have
> closure.
> > > >
> > > > I asked the basic question of why Struts development stagnated and
> > > > people who really should have by now really grappled with this
> question
> > > > and considered it, simply disengaged, and some even started with the
> > > > insults and such.
> > > >
> > > > I don't really like putting you on the spot, Paul (with other
> people, I
> > > > don't mind so much but you seem like a basically okay guy) but I'm
> just
> > > > going to ask you the same question I asked a whole bunch of other
> people
> > > > and never got any answer from.
> > > >
> > > > What, in your opinion, are the reasons that Struts development
> > > stagnated?
> > > >
> > > > I know I'm being a hard-nosed SOB but I also know that the question
> is
> > > > well-formulated, valid, and broadly on-topic for a Struts list.
> > > >
> > > > I'm sure you have an opinion on this subject, Paul. If you won't
> share
> > > > your views, I'd be curious as to why. You see, I'm developing the
> > > > impression that the above question is basically taboo somehow.
> > > >
> > > > Once you pose this question, people just start coming out of the
> > > > woodwork screaming at you to shut up and stuff. So, at this point, I
> > > > pretty much have developed a morbid fascination and am inclined to
> > > > simply ask the question to everybody and see how they react. :-) So
> now
> > > > I am asking you... :-)
> > > >
> > > > Jonathan Revusky
> > > > --
> > > > lead developer, FreeMarker project, http://freemarker.org/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- "Frank W. Zammetti" <fzlists@omnytex.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>Craig McClanahan wrote:
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>No matter where the conversation developed, it has gone in
> directions
> > > that
> > > > >>>are off topic on this list.  Please feel free to continue
the
> > > conversation,
> > > > >>>but do it somewhere else.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>(About to break my own "I'm done posting in this thread" rule)...
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Even I, as someone who was knee-deep in this thread for a while,
> agree
> > > > >>with Craig.  The problem is it was a discussion for a while, but
> has
> > > > >>become people just talking over one another now.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>I'm all for people expressing their viewpoints, no matter how
> > > unpopular,
> > > > >>but at some point it becomes obvious that no one is listening
to
> one
> > > > >>another, and then it's an exercise in futility.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>No one can stop anyone else from posting, not without locking
> someone
> > > > >>out from the list anyway, which I hope never happens to anyone,
> but at
> > > > >>some point everyone has to come to the realization that the
> > > conversation
> > > > >>has past the point of being useful in any real way.  If no one's
> > > opinion
> > > > >>was changed 30 posts ago, chances are it's not going to happen
> now.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Besides, if the points being raised are valid at all, this thread
> > > won't
> > > > >>be the last of its kind...  Someone will at some point start
> another
> > > and
> > > > >>it'll all come out again, so why not hold back some of the talking
> > > > >>points for next time? ;)
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>Craig
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Frank
> > > > >>
> > > >
> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > > >>For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
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> > > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > "You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
> back."
> > ~Dakota Jack~
> >
>
>
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>


--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~

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