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From: Lukasz Lenart <lukaszlenart@apache.org>
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2014 23:00:56 +0100
Message-ID: 
 <CAMopvkMmaDy1SkY8iXn_Jrj-pT_7v6o7MtFjGLK=zkNPdQt4-A@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: New logo
To: Struts Developers List <dev@struts.apache.org>
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Work continues, 3rd version of logo, wdyt? I think dark-blue version
would be also nice.

2013-11-26 8:59 GMT+01:00 Lukasz Lenart <lukaszlenart@apache.org>:
> I have passed your comment to designer - anyway we have time and we
> can always start over when the first logo won't be good enough ;-)
>
>
> Reagrds
> --
> =C5=81ukasz
> + 48 606 323 122 http://www.lenart.org.pl/
>
> 2013/11/24 Rene Gielen <rene.gielen@gmail.com>:
>> Am 20.11.13 14:52, schrieb Christian Grobmeier:
>>> On 12 Nov 2013, at 16:51, Lukasz Lenart wrote:
>>>
>>>> 2013/11/12 Cameron Morris <cmorris@part.net>:
>>>>> I love the look of steampunk and rickety old bridges, but I think it
>>>>> sends
>>>>> the wrong message for a project fighting the perception of being old =
and
>>>>> legacy.  I'd say the more modern looking the better.  However, some
>>>>> of the
>>>>> more modern bridges look so space age it might be hard to tell that t=
hey
>>>>> are bridges if they are made into a small icon.  Perhaps some of thes=
e
>>>>> might spark an idea: http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=3Dmodern%20bridg=
e
>>>>
>>>> Hmm... you know everything new someday will be old anyway ;-) I'd
>>>> rather say let's focus on having cool logo and not the message it
>>>> sends ;-)
>>>
>>> +1 on the cool logo NOW instead of wasting more time.
>>>
>>> Its always funny with us devs. We have a crap logo for years.
>>> Somebody shows up and contributes a fantastic logo (compared to the
>>> other one).
>>> Suddenly all devs become designers and social media communicators.
>>
>> You are right with our out-of-style old logo, and that things should
>> change here. But why exactly are we in such a hurry? Going too long with
>> an old logo does not mean that a new logo should replace the old one as
>> soon as it is just "better". IMHO we would want to replace it with
>> something that satisfies us for years. It should be cool and catchy now
>> and in five years. "Fantastic compared to the other one" is IMO not
>> enough. Do we want old-time users to be surprised to find better logo
>> now, or do we want anyone stumbling over our site or a Zeroturnaround
>> web frameworks survey to think "hey man, nice logo!"?
>>
>> I'm not a social media designer, and for that reason I need to interact
>> with a designer. I need inspiration and suggestions to formulate in turn
>> which directions to go for the next iteration. Since I'm not a designer,
>> I'm for sure too lame with my own cool logo proposal.
>>
>> Over all the years I was involved with design tasks, I've seen design
>> emerge after some iterations in a process similar to what I outlined
>> above. I have never ever experienced being given a first proposal that
>> makes it directly to production.
>>
>>>
>>> Personally I am super-happy that we have such a great proposal.
>>> And if we don't have another option (one of us devs IS a designer AND
>>> does some work)
>>> we should definitely consider it.
>>>
>>
>> I'm super happy with the work being done, and I like some of the ideas
>> incorporated in the first proposals. I like the fact that someone steps
>> up and is kind enough to donate work and creativity, and I am super
>> thankful for that - and, to be honest, it makes me bit shy to provide
>> too much criticism, especially since it is not my profession the actual
>> work is all about.
>>
>> I went back and forth many times the last two weeks to think and
>> re-think if I like the logo, how it might be seen, and what well founded
>> criticism I could give. In my review I tried to both incorporate what I
>> as a non-professional know about design, as well as what I as a
>> "professional design recipient" (read: consumer) feel when I see the log=
o.
>>
>> Some of my thoughts:
>>
>> Most common to me seems a combination of a dedicated logo icon with a
>> clean writing for the brand, or just an elaborate writing without logo
>> icon. From time to time you see some font gimmickry to make a pure
>> writing recognizable. But I have failed so far to come up with a example
>> for a iconified design building a writing and a font design.
>>
>> Have a look at those two sites (scroll to bottom on both)
>> http://devoxx.be/#/sponsors
>> http://www.gopivotal.com/
>>
>> There a good bunch of logos, both of companies and open source projects,
>> that look cool, clean and modern, yet timeless.
>>
>> If you want to follow newest hipster logo trends, http://gruntjs.com/
>> might be a source for inspiration. Nevertheless, this seems to be not so
>> much on the timeless side...
>>
>> That said and reviewed many times during last week, I'm more in favor
>> for the combination of an icon symbol combined with with a clean and
>> modern typographic font for the brand name Struts.
>>
>> Stepping back a bit when viewing the proposed designs, what strikes me
>> most is that iconified graphic elements are used to construct a font.
>> How does this font look like? It does not seem to follow all of the well
>> established rules for font design. If you color it completely black from
>> the outline and reduce it to the font shape, it does not look like very
>> "clean" typography, even a bit clunky. But besides (or even more than?)
>> graphical details and tasteful colouring, the shape makes the first
>> impression to a viewer. I doubt that it is a good idea to bind the font
>> shape of a writing to iconified graphics as building blocks, as this
>> limits how elaborate the typographic shape itself will look like.
>> Designing a font is a science by itself, you can find tons of
>> information on the web. Just for some reading giving an impression:
>> http://designshack.net/articles/typography/8-rules-for-creating-effectiv=
e-typography/
>>
>> As for me, this breaks down to: I have tried to like it, but - as
>> proposed so far - I don't. This is my honest personal view. And I also
>> think it is a great starting point to go into design iteration. It
>> teases me to think, it gives the inspiration someone like me needs to
>> imagine and maybe phrase what he thinks the final logo (or a next step)
>> should look like.
>>
>> Earlier in this discussion, Dave came up with an interesting Google
>> search for an isolated logo icon to maybe be combined with a clean brand
>> writing:
>> https://www.google.com/search?q=3Dsteampunk+box+truss&safe=3Don&espv=3D2=
10&es_sm=3D91&source=3Dlnms&tbm=3Disch&sa=3DX&ei=3DHjuCUq3NCYrnsATbvYLIBQ&v=
ed=3D0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=3D1478&bih=3D1042#es_sm=3D91&espv=3D210&q=3Dbox+truss&=
safe=3Doff&tbm=3Disch
>>
>> Those two for example could be excellent templates for an iconified logo
>> graphic:
>>
>> http://www.google.com/imgres?safe=3Doff&es_sm=3D91&espv=3D210&bih=3D1042=
&biw=3D1478&tbm=3Disch&tbnid=3DeQDpP6WpnMmoXM:&imgrefurl=3Dhttp://www.germa=
nlightproducts.com/products/16-inch-square-box-truss-f44/&docid=3DyGLxIpnpC=
serbM&imgurl=3Dhttp://www.germanlightproducts.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/0=
1/F44Box_0.jpg&w=3D1024&h=3D768&ei=3DzPCRUtuZOYbjswaHzoCwCA&zoom=3D1&ved=3D=
1t:3588,r:73,s:0,i:305&iact=3Drc&page=3D3&tbnh=3D176&tbnw=3D236&start=3D67&=
ndsp=3D35&tx=3D155&ty=3D76
>>
>> http://www.google.com/imgres?safe=3Doff&es_sm=3D91&espv=3D210&bih=3D1042=
&biw=3D1478&tbm=3Disch&tbnid=3DrGzeKbh__BY3LM:&imgrefurl=3Dhttp://www.brown=
swelding.com.au/truss500/&docid=3D-uk8Vty_qJyznM&imgurl=3Dhttp://www.browns=
welding.com.au/truss500/images/500box6way.jpg&w=3D200&h=3D200&ei=3DzPCRUtuZ=
OYbjswaHzoCwCA&zoom=3D1&ved=3D1t:3588,r:78,s:0,i:320&iact=3Drc&page=3D3&tbn=
h=3D160&tbnw=3D160&start=3D67&ndsp=3D35&tx=3D60&ty=3D50
>>
>> Also a very reduced and iconified bridge could be interesting for a logo
>> icon.
>>
>> I suck badly at crafting graphics, but if time permits I'll give it a
>> try to express my thoughts in some graphical draft. But basically my
>> overall thoughts go into a direction like the Typesafe or Hazelcast logo=
s.
>>
>>> As far as I understood it, this contribution is backed by Lukasz
>>> company. I am very grateful
>>> for the huge effort they already put into this.
>>>
>>
>> +1
>>
>>> Instead of discussing completely new approaches and ideas which might
>>> lead to even more discussion,
>>> we all should answer these two question:
>>>
>>> 1) Can you live with the proposal logo?
>>
>> just me: actually no, but it's a great start :)
>>
>>> 2) If yes, do you prefer the dark or the bright version?
>>>
>>> My answer to 1) is YES!!!!
>>> My answer to 2) I LOVE BOTH
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Christian
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> --
>>>> =C5=81ukasz
>>>> + 48 606 323 122 http://www.lenart.org.pl/
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
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>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> http://www.grobmeier.de
>>> @grobmeier
>>> GPG: 0xA5CC90DB
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ren=C3=A9 Gielen
>> http://twitter.com/rgielen
>>
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--=20
=C5=81ukasz
+ 48 606 323 122 http://www.lenart.org.pl/


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