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From James Holmes <ja...@jamesholmes.com>
Subject Re: [s2] The death of the .action extension
Date Mon, 10 Sep 2007 13:32:42 GMT
+1

Ted, I'm with you 100%. James Mitchell and Bill Siggelkow have been preaching to
me about Rails for 6 months now and I have finally taken the time to dig in
deeper. And they are right! It has some amazing concepts. I can't wait to see how
we can evolve Struts towards achieving some of the excellent concepts implemented
in Rails.

james


On Mon Sep 10  9:55 , 'Ted Husted' <husted@apache.org> sent:

>I'm on board with Don's direction, and I'd like to try doing a
>ReSTful, Zero-Configuration, Code Behind MailReader this week, based
>on Brian's SmartURLs plugin, which is putting it all together in a
>single package.
>
>I believe the key point is that we have to develop architectures and
>coding paradigms that let us "say it once". A very good way to say it
>once is to say it with naming conventions, and to say it the URI. (And
>when that doesn't work, annotations!)
>
>Many of us are already use conventions and packed URIs, we just
>haven't been telling the *framework* enough about our conventions so
>that it could follow along on its own.
>
>Personally, I don't see this as a move away from the WebWork or Struts
>coding styles, but a natural progression. (Code-behind is wildcards
>without the wildcards.) We've been trying to write applications this
>way all along. We just couldn't see the architectural forest through
>the  XML-strewn trees. :)
>
>-Ted.
>
>On 9/8/07, Don Brown mrdon@twdata.org> wrote:
>> Personally, I think we have a lot to learn from rails as they play
>> very well off the strengths of the action-based Model2 architecture.
>> Action-based frameworks strengths:
>>  * Simple workflow as in URL -> Action -> View
>>  * Intuitive (using conventions) URL -> Action mappings
>>  * RESTful by being close the the HTTP protocol
>>  * Scalable by not storing view state on the server
>>  * Lightweight in terms of code size and concepts needed to master
>>
>> As our goal is to make developing scalable applications easier and
>> quicker, I think we have a lot to learn from rails.  I hope to spend
>> some time beefing up the RESTful aspects of Struts 2 both for web
>> services and for regular HTML-based applications.  You are right in
>> that there are a lot of options in Struts 2, and we need to do a
>> better job of providing a simple front to Struts 2 that doesn't
>> bombard you with all its options and features.
>>
>> As the web moves to embrace more and more Ajax and web service
>> functionality, I think Struts 2 and its action-based architecture will
>> be well-suited to meet those needs.  If you want to drop components on
>> a page, obviously Struts 2 isn't for you, but if you want a framework
>> on which to build a scalable, public-facing web application supporting
>> mobile, web service, and Ajax clients, I hope Struts 2 will be the
>> logical choise.
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/9/07, Tom Schneider schneidh@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Don Brown wrote:
>> > > Right, and that's why I didn't move to kill it off for 2.1.  Give it
>> > > some time, let the feature get some exercise, then if all agree, we
>> > > could change the default later.  As with any new feature, I'd put it
>> > > in a sort of experimental category for at least one major release.
>> > >
>> > So, do you have a final goal in mind for this or are you just working to
>> > open up options?  I'd be very interested in hearing of the any options
>> > we have.  Are we moving more towards Rails, or are there other better
>> > alternatives?
>
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