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From "David H. DeWolf" <>
Subject Re: Graduation Options (was Re: [PROPOSAL] Updated Tiles Graduation Proposal)
Date Tue, 28 Nov 2006 17:49:02 GMT

Greg Reddin wrote:

>>> 2)  Apache Web Components TLP - What components will make up this 
>>> list?  Who needs to be involved in the discussion?  What's the 
>>> process to proceed?
>> This is my preference.  I think the next steps would be to follow up 
>> with the other potential projects to see if they are even interested. 
>> The core ones that I'd start talking to are:
>> - Tiles (Apache)
>> - Jakarta Commons File Upload (Apache)
>> - Java Web Parts (SF)
>> - XAP (Apache Incubator)
> I see this as being difficult to get approved, much less operational.  I 
> think we need to have a real convincing argument for all these things to 
> live together before we head down this road - not just for political 
> reasons but practical reasons also. I'm not sure how this helps our 
> community situation.  Why would a Web Parts developer start contributing 
> to Tiles just because they are part of the same TLP.  I'm a Struts 
> committer, but I've contributed very little to anything outside of 
> Tiles.  I'm also a Shale committer, but I've not contributed much to the 
> other parts of that project yet either.  Community doesn't just happen 
> because we live in the same neighborhood or even the same house.  There 
> has to be a common goal that will cause people to want to work on Tiles 
> specifically I think.   It would make sense to bring Dimensions and 
> Scopes into a Tiles project.  They deal directly with Tiles.  People 
> interested in one will be interested in the other.  But the above list 
> of components just don't have enough in common to build that kind of 
> community IMO.

Perhaps I'm looking at this too selfishly, but I'm thinking that if 
nothing else the teams can help each other with the infrastructure and 
burden of being a TLP.  For example:

- Moderating Mail Lists
- Board Reports
- Managing Jira
- Community Oversight
- etc. . .

It seems to me like those types of tasks can take a lot of development 
time away from a small team. I've heard of PMC Chairs that are consumed 
by all of this overhead and stop committing code.  I don't ever want to 
get to that point and it seems possible considering the fact that there 
are only 3 of us - 2 that currently commit code.

That said, I do think there's much more potential for commit overlap 
than you give credit. Simply having access to the repo of a sister 
project might spawn some interest.  I know that I'd be apt to dive into 
FileUpload or WebParts if I had commit access.  I've used both before 
but haven't contributed because the burden was too much for the benefit.

At the same time, while I'm sure Dimensions or Scopes are great, I just 
don't have the need for them right now.  And because of that, I'd be 
less apt to contribute.

In other words, I don't think it's "dependency" that makes people 
contribute, I think it's weighing the benefit against the burden.  If we 
lower the burden for key people, they may come to play.

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