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From Berin Lautenbach <>
Subject Re: [Fwd: [VOTE] Put Apache Juice into dormant status]
Date Tue, 17 Jul 2007 10:03:28 GMT
Note that this won't kill JuiCE, just hibernate it until such time as 
someone comes along to reopen it, or fork it in another location.


Werner Dittmann wrote:
> Berin, all,
> just a few days ago I got an e-mail from OSSI (this organization
> prepared and drove the FIPS certification for openSSL) asking
> us if somebody would can improve JuiCE to have it FIPS certified
> as well. As far as I understood JuICE is often used by US
> administration because it is a Java JCE compliant interface
> to openSSL. Pls have a look to the latest e-mail conversation.
> If anbbody with some know-how would like to volounteer pls get
> in contace with Steve ( and myself.
> This I would ask to keep JuICE until this issue is sorted out.
> Regards,
> Werner
> <quote>
> Steve,
> unfortunatly I'm not able to do this completely on my own. JuiCE and other
> Open source acivities are just a hobby of mine and I do it in parallel to
> my normal job. I would appreciate if somebody else can take over the main
> activities.
> Of course I would be happy to support the person who takes the burden
> to enable JuiCE to be FIPS compliant. Coordination could be done via
> e-mail or VoIP calls, depending on the time zone of the participating
> persons  :-)  .
> And yes: <> is the latest
> version of the source.
> Regards,
> Werner
> Steve Marquess wrote:
>>> Steve Marquess wrote:
>>>>> Werner:
>>>>> One of the activities that occupies much of our time here at OSSI is
>>>>> matching up the needs of commercial and government entities with the
>>>>> appropriate resources in the open source community.  Usually the sponsor
>>>>>  requirements are pretty clear cut ("obtain FIPS 140-2 validation for
>>>>> X", "add support for platform Y to product Z", etc.).
>>>>> This situation is a little different in that the prospective sponsor,
>>>>> large U.S. government research laboratory, appears to just want JuiCE
>>>>> be a viable actively maintained product.  Apparently they want to use
>>>>> extensively but are concerned about the lack of activity and unpolished
>>>>> state.
>>>>> Here specifically is what my contact there asked for:  "Besides work
>>>>> supporting FIPS mode, I'd like to see money put towards more
>>>>> documentation, tutorials, and a more collaborative project home page
>>>>> attract wider adoption."
>>>>> The only actual functional enhancement they're asking for, FIPS mode
>>>>> support, is relatively simple, as most a few day's work.  This contact
>>>>> went on to ask me to write a Statement of Work ("SOW", a description
>>>>> tasks to be performed for specified payment) which would be the basis
>>>>> for a contract.
>>>>> If you're interested, here's how we can work it.  If you can give me
>>>>> some details along the following lines...
>>>>>     1) Cost to implement FIPS mode support (see
>>>>> for details, it
>>>>> be as simple as adding a FIPS_mode_set() call.
>>>>>     2) Some elaboration on the "documentation, tutorials" objective,
>>>>> what you and/or your collaborators would expect to be paid for same;
>>>>>     3) Brief description of what the "project home page" would look
>>>>> like; ok to just reference an existing project as a model, and cost to
>>>>> implement;
>>>>>     4) Any other enhancements that have been contemplated that would
>>>>> of interest to the general end user community, and cost for same
>>>>> ...then I will prepare a formal proposal for our prospective sponsor
>>>>> see what funding they will commit to.
>>>>> Note we can host the project web site on OSSI hardware, if appropriate,
>>>>> but are not in a position to generate or maintain much content.
>>>>> For funding think in terms of thousands of dollars (or euros), not
>>>>> hundreds.  I believe that if they feel they are receiving value that
>>>>> they would be willing to fund this effort on a long term basis to the
>>>>> tune of thousands or even tens of thousands per year.  We won't know
>>>>> sure until they are presented with a formal contract, of course, and
>>>>> there will undoubtedly be some back-and-forth negotiation.
>>>>> As many project contributors or collaborators can contribute as
>>>>> appropriate.  We prefer to work with a projects original contributors
>>>>> and their circle of collaborators where possible.  We'll want a single
>>>>> point of contact with OSSI, but end results that please the sponsor are
>>>>> all that really matters.
>>>>> Speaking of which, I don't want to step on any toes at Apache.  If we
>>>>> succeed in securing financial support for JuiCE we would not want to
>>>>> disturb the relationship with the Apache Incubator.  Is there anyone
>>>>> Apache I should sound out for permission/participation?  OSSI has not
>>>>> had the opportunity to work with the ASF yet, but we expect to in the
>>>>> near future for other initiatives so I don't want to offend anyone there.
>>>>> Oh, I take it that is the
>>>>> latest and greatest source, and that there is no JuiCE project page per
>>> Werner, all:
>>> We're being nagged again by the sponsor.  They seem to be really
>>> interested in reviving the JuiCE project.  Any interest in working with
>>> us to develop a proposal to secure the funding they have indicated would
>>> be forthcoming?
>>> If none of the original maintainers are able to participate we can
>>> engage Java developers elsewhere, but we'd prefer to work with the
>>> original team if at all possible.
>>> Thanks,
>>> -Steve M.
> </quote>
> Berin Lautenbach wrote:
>> If we want to keep this going - we need to call it out now.
>> Cheers,
>>     Berin
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: [VOTE] Put Apache Juice into dormant status
>> Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 00:12:13 -0400
>> From: Noel J. Bergman <>
>> Reply-To:,    <>
>> To: <>
>> Nothing appears to be happening, and there is no one around to provide
>> status or anything else.
>>     --- Noel
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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