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From Ramazan Ergüder Bekrek <e.bek...@yandex.com>
Subject Re: Evaluating Apache Royale for the long term
Date Fri, 28 Sep 2018 10:08:21 GMT
<div xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">Trust me they will come back!</div><div><br
/></div><div><br /></div><div>27.09.2018, 12:53, "Fréderic
Cox" &lt;coxfrederic@gmail.com&gt;:</div><blockquote type="cite"><div
dir="ltr">Hi Alex,<div><br /></div><div>Correct, I'm not going
away from MXML nor Actionscript at all because I know about the advantages and workflows I
love so much. The reality here is that we don't find a lot of AS3 developers anymore though,
that is a small concern I have at the moment. :)</div></div><br /><div><div
dir="ltr">On Thu, Sep 27, 2018 at 3:00 AM Alex Harui &lt;<a href="mailto:aharui@adobe.com">aharui@adobe.com</a>&gt;
wrote:<br /></div><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex;">





<div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div>
<p>Hi <span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">I understand you now.  Royale should
be a good choice as it can be thought of exactly as you are thinking of it:  a lighterweight
Flex-like SDK that can output to JS.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">I thought that you were trying to
get away from MXML and ActionScript as well.  I think there are so many advantages to working
with a structured language.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Thanks,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">-Alex</span></p>
<p> </p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1pt;padding:3pt 0in 0in 0in;">
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"><b><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic Cox &lt;<a
href="mailto:coxfrederic@gmail.com" target="_blank">coxfrederic@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Reply-To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 12:56 PM<br />
<b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: Evaluating Apache Royale for the long term</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">Hi Alex, </p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">Two main reasons: </p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">1) Being able to have the source compile to JS, since
that is what everyone is doing lately :-) I don't want to exclude my source code from future
projects by not using JS</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">2) Flex is more "bloated" than Royale (PAYG), so I think
in the long term it will be better to have more performant code.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">Correct me if I'm wrong :-)</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">On Wed, Sep 26, 2018 at 9:01 PM Alex Harui &lt;<a
href="mailto:aharui@adobe.com" target="_blank">aharui@adobe.com</a>&gt; wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in;">
<div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
Hi <span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic,</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">That’s interesting. What is it about Flex
that you want to get away from?</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">I suppose you can load the JS into a webview,
but I think you might need some more glue to have the JS access the Native Extension.  But
I think that you can write such glue.  Not sure how efficient it will be.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">-Alex</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.5in;">
 </p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1pt;padding:3pt 0in 0in 0in;">
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<b><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">From: </span></b><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic Cox &lt;<a href="mailto:coxfrederic@gmail.com"
target="_blank">coxfrederic@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br />
<b>Reply-To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 11:39 AM<br />
<b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: Evaluating Apache Royale for the long term</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
Hi Alex, </p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
I'm trying to go look into a path to get away from Flex rather than AIR. Most of my apps are
desktop based, and the ones that are browser based we are loading into an AIR container (directly
loading the SWF) anyway.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
So I guess I can use royale and then load the resulting JS into a webview in AIR? That way
I can still use native extensions?</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
I spent some time trying Apache Royale today but it will take me many more days before I really
get used and experienced in it but I'll try to help where I can. Lot's of stuff to learn about
it first but it looks really promising.</p>
</div>
</div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
<div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
On Wed, Sep 26, 2018 at 6:09 PM Alex Harui &lt;<a href="mailto:aharui@adobe.com" target="_blank">aharui@adobe.com</a>&gt;
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5pt;">
<div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
Hi <span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic,</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Just so I’m clear, are all of your apps
AIR apps and not browser apps?  If so, and you want to get away from AIR, then you will have
to decide on how to run the resulting JS.  Royale has support for Cordova and Node. 
 I haven’t done much with Node, so not sure how much graphical UI you could do there. 
I think you can also use Chromium Embedded as well.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">You will need to pick your runtime environment
first.  I will assume the Browser is not one of your choices, but there may be a way to use
it, I don’t know.  I’m not sure there is a 100% equivalent to AIR.  I think
 you’ll always have to trade-off some feature or build missing capabilities.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Regarding Native Extensions:  I believe each
runtime environment has a way to call native code.  So, your Native Extensions probably can’t
be used as-is, but the code that actually does the work can probably be re-used
 to some extent.  For example, if you chose Cordova, you can probably make a Cordova plugin
using some of that Native Extension code.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">I think each runtime environment also has
a way to launch other apps and access files.  Cordova has a File plugin and we have some
examples that use it.  A volunteer could make a more Flex-like wrapper for it.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">AMF works in lots of places but there are
probably still bugs.  I don’t see any reason it wouldn’t eventually work for your app.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">TourDeFlex uses modules.  It can load modules
now.  Royale does not support unloading modules because the runtime environments don’t
make it easy to remove loaded code.  As I get more of TourDeFlex working and other
 people get their apps working we will get a better idea of how important “stuck code”
is.  Unloading the instances of objects created by module code will likely be far more important,
and that cleanup generally needs to be done whether the code unloads or
 not.   Also, because Royale doesn’t currently support embedding, the size of the loaded
module may not be as significant.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">There hasn’t been a lot of attention paid
to Royale outside of the browser, so expect to run into more issues, but we do have intentions
of getting it all to work.  We expect you and other volunteers to contribute
 to making it work by contributing code and patches.  If you do enough of that, you will
probably be granted committer status, and then you have much more control over Royale in the
long term.</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;"> </span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">HTH,</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
<span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">-Alex</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
<p style="margin-left:1in;">
 </p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1pt;padding:3pt 0in 0in 0in;">
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
<b><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">From: </span></b><span
style="font-size:12pt;color:black;">Fréderic Cox &lt;<a href="mailto:coxfrederic@gmail.com"
target="_blank">coxfrederic@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br />
<b>Reply-To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 2:31 AM<br />
<b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>"
&lt;<a href="mailto:users@royale.apache.org" target="_blank">users@royale.apache.org</a>&gt;<br
/>
<b>Subject: </b>Evaluating Apache Royale for the long term</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Hi guys, </p>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Finally you have my full attention :-) I am spending the remainder of this week (at least)
to evaluate using Apache Royale for our company's apps. I'm evaluating wether it is a good
course to convert our existing flex apps (which currently target Mac OSX, Windows
 and iOS using Adobe AIR).</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
I have a couple of early questions after installing VSCode and Josh's AS/MXML extension.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Our apps are pretty complex, using things like:</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
* Modules (one application uses ModuleLoader quite heavily)</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
* Accessing user's hard disk to manipulate files</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
* AMFPHP for communication with PHP backend</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
* NativeProcess API to convert images using a compiled version of ImageMagick (so accessing
.exe files and mac executable scripts)</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
* NativeExtensions</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Can this all be used with ApacheRoyale?</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Thanks for the information, I'm going to experiment with the examples and try to convert some
parts of apps to see where this is going.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Best regards,</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
Fréderic</p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="margin-left:1.5in;">
 </p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div>
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