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From "Michał Kłeczek (XPro Sp. z o. o.)" <michal.klec...@xpro.biz>
Subject Re: OSGi
Date Sat, 04 Feb 2017 10:21:33 GMT
Once you transfer the code with your data - the issue of code version 
synchronization disappears, doesn't it?
It also makes the wire data format irrelevant. At least for "short lived 
serialized states".

I fail to understand how JSON or XML changes anything here.

In the end all of the arguments against Java Object Serialization boil 
down to:
"It is easy to use but if not used carefully it will bite you - so it is 
too easy to use"

What I do not like about Java Object Serialization has nothing to do 
with the format of persistent data
but rather with the APIs - it is inherently blocking by design.


Niclas Hedhman wrote:
> Gregg,
> I know that you can manage to "evolve" the binary format if you are
> incredibly careful and not make mistakes. BUT, that seems really hard,
> since EVEN Sun/Oracle state that using Serilazation for "long live objects"
> are highly discouraged. THAT is a sign that it is not nearly as easy as you
> make it sound to be, and it is definitely different from XML/JSON as once
> the working codebase is lost (i.e. either literally lost (yes, I have been
> involved trying to restore that), or modified so much that compatibility
> broke, which happens when serialization is not the primary focus of a
> project) then you are pretty much screwed forever, unlike XML/JSON.
> Now, you may say, that is for "long lived serialized states" but we are
> dealing with "short lived" ones. However, in today's architectures and
> platforms, almost no organization manages to keep all parts of a system
> synchronized when it comes to versioning. Different parts of a system is
> upgraded at different rates. And this is essentially the same as "long
> lived objects" ---  "uh this was serialized using LibA 1.1, LibB 2.3 and
> JRE 1.4, and we are now at LibA 4.6, LibB 3.1 and Java 8", do you see the
> similarity? If not, then I will not be able to convince you. If you do,
> then ask "why did Sun/Oracle state that long-lived objects with Java
> Serialization was a bad idea?", or were they also clueless on how to do it
> right, which seems to be your actual argument.
> And I think (purely speculative) that many people saw exactly this problem
> quite early on, whereas myself I was at the time mostly in relatively small
> confined and controlled environments, where up-to-date was managed. And
> took me much longer to realize the downsides that are inherent.
> Cheers
> Niclas

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