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From Greg Brown <gkbr...@mac.com>
Subject Re: [RFC] Swing interop features
Date Tue, 03 Aug 2010 12:37:47 GMT
The competitive landscape is most definitely broader than just Swing/JavaFX. I doubt that Pivot
will appeal to .NET users, but Flex and GWT developers are certainly also in Pivot's target
market.

On Aug 2, 2010, at 9:57 PM, aappddeevv wrote:

> Do you think that if someone has to move from Swing to JavaFX, that the
> decision will then become bigger--does the entire UI stack come under
> scrutiny? E.g. if I have to have to move from Swing, perhaps I should
> consider a wider variety of toolkits other than JavaFX? If so, the
> competition is bigger than swingers and the migration benefits story may
> need to be different because component reuse may not be the key factor and
> reskilling may not be critical.
> 
> I don't know the answer. Most likely new pivot developers have a swing
> background but I am not sure there is a linkage beyond that.
> 
> If integrating somewhat with swing brings a wider variety of components
> available, that does not seem so bad.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Brown [mailto:gkbrown@mac.com] 
> Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 1:58 PM
> To: user@pivot.apache.org
> Cc: dev@pivot.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [RFC] Swing interop features
> 
> Yeah, writing a L&F is not a trivial task. But it is doable, and may be
> worthwhile if it helps attract new developers.
> 
> My primary goal in improving Swing support is to give developers another
> reason to consider Pivot over JavaFX, which apparently doesn't provide any
> migration path from Swing. Swing developers constitute a large percentage of
> Pivot's target audience, so making it easier for them to switch to Pivot
> seems like a good idea.
> 
> Anyone else want to comment?
> 
> 
> On Aug 2, 2010, at 10:09 AM, Noel Grandin wrote:
> 
>> Greg Brown wrote:
>>>> Visual consistency is a double edged sword. If things are obviously
> different, people live with it, but once you start
>>>> down the road towards consistency, users will get pickier and pickier.
>>> My idea was to back the L&F with the actual Terra skins, so in theory
> they should look exactly the same.
>>> 
>> Sounds like a good idea. But quite a lot of work. The Swing skin class
> code is pretty messy inside.
>>>> I would rather we simply focussed on improving the Pivot L&F - for
> example, the default fonts are completely wrong on my
>>>> desktop.
>>> Can you elaborate? The default font is Verdana, which (IMO) looks pretty
> good across all platforms. What font would you prefer to use?
>>> 
>>> What other suggestions do you have for improving Terra? The feedback I
> have gotten recently is that the current L&F is actually pretty good.
>>> 
>> The font size is wrong. We run a lot of large screens at high resolution
> resolution here, so it's not uncommon for the
>> font size to be non-default.
>> 
>> Pivot in general looks pretty good by itself, but because it doesn't use
> the default system font, and it doesn't use it
>> at the correct size, it tends to be the odd one out when used in
> conjunction with other stuff.
> 


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