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From Geoffrey Young <>
Subject Re: [mp2] loading automatically?
Date Fri, 13 Aug 2004 02:54:36 GMT

Stas Bekman wrote:
> We have a need to be able to load mp2 modules at the server startup
> (e.g. APR::Error), but we are dependent on the users to load
>, without which mp2 modules won't be found (if installed
> into Apache2/). 

in the test suite or in real life?

> So here is a proposal how to solve this problem.
> mod_perl will load by itself, as soon as it starts
> perl. 

so Apache2 would be called after the interpreter is launched but before,
say, a <Perl> or PerlLoadModule directive is run?  that would be a
requirement I would think.

> For most people it'll just save them the need to type
> PerlModule Apache2

for the moment.  as people move away from mp1 the Apache2 hack will
disappear.  I wouldn't expect to need it at all anyplace other than
development, so I would suspect that for the majority of eventual
installations (1 dev box versus a production cluster) we would be cluttering
@INC for no reason.

> For those who will want to adjust @INC before Apache2 is loaded (to find
> a different mp2), there is PerlSwitches, which must be set before perl
> is started. So lets say you want to load your private mp2 (installed at
> /home/stas/perl5/) on a system where there is already mp2 installed
> under /usr/lib/perl5, so your httpd.conf will look like:
> LoadModule perl_module modules/
> PerlSwitches -Mlib=/home/stas/perl5/

I'm not sure I follow how this.  if your mp2 install is in /home/stas/perl5
then won't the load of APR::Error be found in @INC _before_ the -Mlib call,
therefore using a version from someplace _other_ than -Mlib?  if so, you
would almost always load the wrong version (or at least not the one you
thought you were pointing at with -Mlib).  if not, then why not just let the
users specify PerlModule Apache2 themselves without the magic?

> So the only inconvenience it creates is that you can't do it from your
>, but must use PerlSwitches. PERL5LIB env var is not
> applicable as it's ignored by Perl when -T is in effect.
> Can anybody see any potential problems with this solution?

perhaps.  once you load Apache2 @INC is forever tainted with whatever finds.  granted, the -Mlib statement will give the new lib
priority, but it still feels a bit strange to have @INC reflect stuff I may
not be interested in - for instance, would this make it more difficult to
track down problems where there the -Mlib install is incomplete so perl
picks mix-and-match mp2 packages from lib and lib/Apache2?

I'm not convinced this is a good idea, at least not yet :).  but if there is
no way to work around the APR::Error thing then I think what we really need
is a way to remove Apache2 entries from @INC.  that way a user can
completely cancel the effects of Apache2 if they want, not merely gloss over
it with extra libs.

another suggestion is to make it a compile-time option, loading Apache2 by
default but giving the ability to turn it off.  this seems a bit cleaner
than making an anti-Apache2 module or directive that people need to remember
to call if they _don't_ want Apache2 messing with their @INC.


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