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From "Think" <>
Subject RE: Being Good, was: RE: Reading and Exporting spreadsheets--another commentary
Date Wed, 08 Jan 2014 00:49:00 GMT
Thank you Vincent. I am a girl, even though I show up as "think." My name is


It's nice to know that I am not the only person on this listserv who expects
people to be nice to each other.


Brenda Hart Neihouse


From: Vincent Juliano [] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2014 4:36 PM
Subject: Re: Being Good, was: RE: Reading and Exporting
spreadsheets--another commentary



You're exactly the people he's talking about.  Unfortunately you broke a
resolve and responded.  His points are well taken. Perhaps your MOM didn't
teach YOU to say nice things or be quiet. 


I am very old and probably out of my depth with all the new young
whippersnappers but Good manners have never gone away. There's just a lot of
people who cannot incorporate  Binaural with social grace.





On Jan 7, 2014, at 3:31 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote:

On Mon, Jan 06, 2014 at 11:09:55PM -0500, Think wrote:

I seldom reply to trolls but I'll make an exception in this case.

I have been quietly watching the notes back and forth and have only once or
twice ventured into the writing and reading space of this list. Once,
someone told me I digressed too much and that I was wrong for having
bothered everyone with my verbiage.


I was like "wow, dude. I thought the listserv was for talking about the

Again true. Get it?

Since then, I have been watching and reading.


Personally, I am disgusted at how many of you treat each other.


I am an advocate for disabled people. I "yell" at people for a "living" (I
don't get paid for it so I have to use the "".) And even I refuse to stoop
so low as to denigrate someone for being frustrated or for having newbie


I am 53. I coded in Fortran in 1974. I was on a mainframe before most of you
knew what a computer was. I hand coded HTML from the early 90's until 2002.
I owned a brand development firm. I ran five businesses. My largest project
management job was a 14million$ project in my early 30's. I am currently
relearning CSS after going 12 years without coding a website, because I was
doing other things. I am learning it so I can direct our web designer and
our back end coder.

My God you're wonderful.


Open office is interesting to me because our project, the elai Project, will
be licensed wholly under the Creative Commons License. So I wanted to
specify one all purpose software package for the project, and for every
organization that adopts the package. Initially, elai will help to make
libraries completely accessible to disabled people. Hospitals are next, with
police stations, and many other locally, state and federally funded
organizations following.


But after watching you guys take pot shots at each other and work from an "I
don't have to be nice to anyone" paradigm, I am about to throw in the towel
on OO or alternatively to warn elai Project participants to stay away from
the listserv.


Be nice. Grow up. Get outside of yourselves and help each other. Focus on
where you connect and not where you disagree. 


And posters: don't assume that everyone is here to help you. They have their
own lives and their own jobs and their own families and priorities. Be
polite. Don't be a bull in a china shop.

In case you haven't already learned it, attitudes are learned early in
life. You aren't going to change them by lecturing on this (or any
other) list. Save your figurative breath and your time. If it's too much
for you to bear, well.....don't let the door hit you on your way out.


And if more experienced users set a good example, it's more likely the
newbies will follow suit.


Likely this list needs a moderator. Does it have one? I am not stepping up
for the job, but someone with a sense of Zen and no fear of confrontation


If you want to flame me, you might want to think again. Most of your ISP's
have a policy of no spam/hate/scam/flame. I have reported people to their
ISP's before and I will do it again. There is a difference between free
speech and hate speech. Hate speech is not protected under the Constitution
and your ISP's won't tolerate it either.

Threats can get you kicked off the list if you continue.


Please stop treating each other like garbage. For none of you is garbage.
Each of you just comes from your own singular perspective, some of you are
frustrated, some of you don't understand how this works and some of you need
some perspective.


Perspective, best served up warm.

Sure thing, Mom.

P.S. It appears that you're unfamiliar with the protocol of posting to a
mail list re: over quoting.

Bob Holtzman
Your mail is being read by tight lipped 
NSA agents who fail to see humor in Doctor 
Key ID 8D549279


Vincent Juliano


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