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From Rob Weir <>
Subject Re: Clarifying facts
Date Wed, 14 Mar 2012 04:43:06 GMT
On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 12:24 AM, Joe Schaefer <> wrote:
> I'm not the first person to have noticed that you can leave
> no stone unturned in your quest for being in the right, no
> matter whose feelings happen to get in the way.
> And yes removing someone's contributions to a foundation resource
> in the manner you have done is a form of bullying.  There is a
> world of difference between email banter most of which aren't
> contributions in any way and signing up to a wiki and using
> it properly in the way Simon had done.  Your claims that his
> work was always intended to become an official site document
> are a load of crap.  He started off by asking those questions
> about his own perspective and as Pedro challenged him to
> work it out on the wiki- other participants made modest
> adjustments to the document in a collaborative spirit.  You
> made no such effort to work with Simon on the document he created.
> You couldhave discussed Simon's work over email, and took
> the approach that he needed to be "mentored" a bit in terms
> of his writing style and answers, but you opted to just be
> aggressive again and completely edit his words out of the
> document.  That is not the Apache way- better to provide
> *alternative* wording in places you disagreed with the prose
> and let some time pass so people, including Simon, could
> factor those alternatives into the ongoing collaboration.
> Options and preferences are always easier to digest over
> time than when applied with blunt force.

I disagree entirely.  Simon was the one apply the blunt instrument
here.  He started the day by posting on Google+:

"Since there is no currently maintained version of
following Oracle disbanding the team, and since the new Apache
OpenOffice hasn't shipped, defaulting to LibreOffice is the only
responsible thing to do at the moment."

I called FUD on him and responded with a list of  of assertions about
OpenOffice and challenged me to find deny any of them.  I denied the
bait.  He them brought this list to ooo-dev,posted them and demanded
answers and was kindly told that no one was interested in debating
this. No one took the bait.  So he then decided to put this into an
official-looking FAQ form and answer his own questions with his own
answers.  This all to back up a petty FUD on Google+ from earlier in
the day.

This was not a honest attempt at collaboration.  It was just a tirade
from Simon, spread over three sites/lists.  I'm sorry if you can't see


> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Rob Weir <>
>> To:
>> Cc:
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 12:07 AM
>> Subject: Re: Clarifying facts
>> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Joe Schaefer <>
>> wrote:
>>>  You are still not learning anything from what I am saying
>>>  which is a shame for both yourself and the project.  This
>>>  document wasn't 24 hours old before you completely wrote
>>>  off Simon's contributions to it.  No person that comes to
>>>  the ASF seeking to contribute to a foundation resource should
>>>  ever be subjected to bullying like that by project members.
>>>  The fact is you're attitude sucked about what he was doing
>> Joe, you are using inflammatory language here.  Shame, bullying, etc.
>> I'll ask you to please cease.  Editing a wiki is not bullying.
>> -Rob

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