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From Michael Dick <michael.d.d...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] localized trace messages
Date Tue, 08 Jun 2010 14:37:59 GMT
Resurrecting this thread.

Pinaki has recently advocated introducing a new debug logging level. Adding
a new level could be confusing - the difference between debug and trace is
not intuitively obvious. Before introducing a new construct I think we need
a compelling reason for localized trace.

Thus far the main justifications are: precedent (trace has always been
localized), and the existence of some trace messages which are user facing.

For the former I think there's sufficient sentiment that localizing trace is
overkill. For the latter I submit that such messages are really info or
warning messages (an example that proves me wrong might be good).

-mike

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 9:34 AM, Donald Woods <dwoods@apache.org> wrote:

> I have to agree with Mike and Rick, that TRACE messages are for us (the
> project developers) and not the end users.  That is the philosophy of
> all the other Apache projects I'm involved with (Geronimo and Bean
> Validation) and other projects we use in Geronimo (like Derby, OpenEJB,
> ActiveMQ and Axis2....)
>
> If we start providing translated trace messages, then we'll -
> 1) bloat the size of our jars
> 2) probably never have fully translated trace messages, as these change
> more often than Log messages
> 3) will complicate the diagnosis of reported problems, as we'll have to
> spend more of our time converting from the submitted locale to our own
>
> I'd have to vote -1 to providing translated TRACE messages.
>
>
> -Donald
>
>
> On 4/9/10 12:43 PM, Michael Dick wrote:
> > Hi Pinaki,
> >
> > That's a different definition of TRACE than I'm used to. I was under the
> > impression that trace *is* for developers. It's hard to find a consensus
> on
> > the Internet but I can point to this
> > definition<
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracing_%28software%29#Event_logging_versus_tracing
> >which
> > I think sums it up.
> >
> > If we do go with your definition of trace I'd argue that we need a new
> log
> > level which is for developers, not for users.
> >
> > -mike
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 11:26 AM, Pinaki Poddar <ppoddar@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> TRACE messages are *not* for the developer -- they are for the user
> (under
> >> duress and using them as the last resort to figure out a problem) and
> they
> >> must be localized.
> >>
> >> During development a developer may temporarily use whatever mechanics to
> >> suit his/her style -- but once the development is complete, then
> cleaning
> >> the workspace is part of the work process.
> >>
> >>
> >> -----
> >> Pinaki
> >> --
> >> View this message in context:
> >>
> http://n2.nabble.com/DISCUSS-localized-trace-messages-tp4877982p4878105.html
> >> Sent from the OpenJPA Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> >>
> >
>

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