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From "Jacques Le Roux" <jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com>
Subject Re: Setup of ofbiz, was Unable to find ofbiz.jar file
Date Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:48:42 GMT
Maybe more explanations, provided by Ruth, and then everybody will be happy again for a long
time (without kids: in French for "And 
they lived happily ever after" we say "ils vécurent heureux et eurent beaucoup d'enfants"
which means "they lived happily and had 
many children", the marvellous time of Failry tales...)

Jacques

Scott Gray wrote:
> It's already there, underneath the 4.0 download:
>> You can also get nightly builds from the {link}snapshots{link} page.
>
> Regards
> Scott
>
> On 27/08/2010, at 8:12 AM, Ruth Hoffman wrote:
>
>> Sure. I'd be happy to do that.
>> Regards,
>> Ruth
>>
>> Jacques Le Roux wrote:
>>> Maybe w e could have a link from http://ofbiz.apache.org/download.html to  nightly
builds with a clear explanation of what it
>>> is, and should be used for? If we agree on that, maybe  Ruth  could provide the
text...
>>>
>>> Also It seems Raj wants to improve the startofbiz files... Let's see with what
he will come with...
>>>
>>> Jacques
>>>
>>> From: "Ruth Hoffman" <rhoffman@aesolves.com>
>>>> Hi BJ
>>>> What I suggest is that we just call this a "draw" and move on.
>>>> Thanks for all your help.
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Ruth
>>>>
>>>> BJ Freeman wrote:
>>>>> You are still confusing nightly builds of the branch 9.04 with the release
zip.
>>>>> the release zip never had jar files.
>>>>> what you call release were the nightly builds that are still availible
and I gave you a link to.
>>>>> what I suggest is you download the nightly build for the equivalent 9.04
release and allow people to download from your site.
>>>>> then if fits all your criteria that you set out previously.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> =========================
>>>>> BJ Freeman  <http://bjfreeman.elance.com>
>>>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation  <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=52>
>>>>> Specialtymarket.com  <http://www.specialtymarket.com/>
>>>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist
>>>>>
>>>>> Chat  Y! messenger: bjfr33man
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ruth Hoffman sent the following on 8/26/2010 12:12 PM:
>>>>>> Hi BJ:
>>>>>> Just the way it has always been done. You evaluate the download,
decide
>>>>>> what changes you'd like to make, and then set about making those
>>>>>> changes. Nothing new in that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All I'm suggesting is the we make the evaluation of OFBiz easier
for
>>>>>> those who are new to the project by minimizing the possible problems
>>>>>> that may arise when getting started. Note, this was how OFBiz was
>>>>>> distributed as recently as 4 months ago. There is nothing new here!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>
>>>>>> BJ Freeman wrote:
>>>>>>> so someone download the file like you say it should be.
>>>>>>> then they decide to know use ofbiz in production.
>>>>>>> how do you propose they do that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> =========================
>>>>>>> BJ Freeman <http://bjfreeman.elance.com>
>>>>>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation
>>>>>>> <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=52>
>>>>>>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/>
>>>>>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ruth Hoffman sent the following on 8/26/2010 11:01 AM:
>>>>>>>> Hi BJ:
>>>>>>>> Sorry, I don't understand your question.
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and what do you propose for those that decide to make
use ofbiz?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> =========================
>>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman <http://bjfreeman.elance.com>
>>>>>>>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=52>
>>>>>>>>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/>
>>>>>>>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ruth Hoffman sent the following on 8/26/2010 10:19 AM:
>>>>>>>>>> Hi BJ:
>>>>>>>>>> My suggestion - as I have said many times before
- is for the official
>>>>>>>>>> Apache OFBiz download page (http://ofbiz.apache.org/download.html)
to
>>>>>>>>>> provide a link to download of a "stable released"
version of OFBiz
>>>>>>>>>> that is:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pre-built (all jar files included)
>>>>>>>>>> Has the seed, demo and all other available data loaded
into the
>>>>>>>>>> currently distributed database - which is Derby
>>>>>>>>>> And the name of this file should have the SVN version
number
>>>>>>>>>> included in it. (This is just in case someone like
me would like to
>>>>>>>>>> participate and provide JIRA posts.)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not concerned with developer's site or the snapshot
site. IMHO, no
>>>>>>>>>> new user should ever be downloading from these sites
unless they
>>>>>>>>>> understand upfront how all this works. [To keep this
all in
>>>>>>>>>> perspective:
>>>>>>>>>> You don't see the Tomcat people pointing new users
to the
>>>>>>>>>> development/source code site.]
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Prettty simple.
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> for the sake of discussion lets say you have
the equivalent of a
>>>>>>>>>>> nightly build for the release, which btw you
can get now, not just as
>>>>>>>>>>> a release.
>>>>>>>>>>> what do you propose for those that decide to
make use ofbiz? Mind you
>>>>>>>>>>> the demo is running in derby.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> =========================
>>>>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman <http://bjfreeman.elance.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=52>
>>>>>>>>>>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/>
>>>>>>>>>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Ruth Hoffman sent the following on 8/26/2010
9:40 AM:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi BJ:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sorry, my mistake. Yes, I meant seed and
demo data. IMHO, the OFBiz
>>>>>>>>>>>> Release that is on the official download
page should be fully
>>>>>>>>>>>> functional
>>>>>>>>>>>> out-of-the-box. For example, if you download
a version of Tomcat or
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache web server, you get a fully functional
demonstration of how
>>>>>>>>>>>> these
>>>>>>>>>>>> work out-of-the-box. The value in this is
that if the user
>>>>>>>>>>>> attempts to
>>>>>>>>>>>> install Tomcat and does not get the index.html
page (or whatever the
>>>>>>>>>>>> startup page is these days) then they know
something is wrong
>>>>>>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>>>>>>> download and/or with the unpacking of the
code.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> In the OFBiz case, because is at least one
additional step is
>>>>>>>>>>>> involved
>>>>>>>>>>>> and at least 2 more variables are thrown
in the mix: Java and
>>>>>>>>>>>> building
>>>>>>>>>>>> jar files & loading demo data - if something
goes wrong, well, for a
>>>>>>>>>>>> seasoned user such as yourself, no big deal.
But for inexperienced
>>>>>>>>>>>> OFBiz
>>>>>>>>>>>> users, it may mean the difference between
giving up and going to
>>>>>>>>>>>> another
>>>>>>>>>>>> project or simply downloading it again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe no big deal to the developers who frequent
this list. But
>>>>>>>>>>>> certainly a big deal to potential new users.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Just my 2cents.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> did you mean Demo data.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> with seed data alone you can not even
login to ofbiz.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> =========================
>>>>>>>>>>>>> BJ Freeman <http://bjfreeman.elance.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier
Automation
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=52>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ruth Hoffman sent the following on 8/26/2010
9:04 AM:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi All:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I respectfully beg to differ here:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There is no reason for a small business
to have to use SVN in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> order to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> implement OFBiz. While it is nice
to have that functionality,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> miss
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the SVN version information that
is no longer available in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recent
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "releases" from the download site,
I've successfully implement
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OFBiz application without ever using
the SVN functionality. Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> course,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm just one developer - SVN really
shines when you have multiple
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> developers working on the same code.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Secondly, why would the compiled
binary always be updated? I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thought
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> once a "Release" was released, the
only updates are bug fixes. And
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> past conversations on this list,
those only happen - maybe once a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quarter.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is not rocket science. The proposal
to re-instate the binary
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> jar
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> files and install the seed-data for
a fully functional version of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OFBiz
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - one that runs out-of-the-box, is
what was available as an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> official
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache OFBiz Release and download
as recently as 4 months ago.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> someone decided (ok Adrian, say what
you must) to change this.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Matt Warnock wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have to agree with Scott, there
is no big effort required here.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OFBiz
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is a development platform, it
is constantly being updated, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> branches are getting new fixes
constantly. It is inefficient to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> download a "compiled binary distribution"
which is constantly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> updated, so learning to use SVN,
even for branches, is really a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> must.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And that means recompiling the
code.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As someone pointed out earlier,
the instructions just need to be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fixed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so that new user expectations
are appropriately managed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As to the effort of creating
a binary distribution, I would much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rather
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> see that same effort spent on
solving the in-place database
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> upgrade
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> issues that have been discussed
here for some time, for example.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Those bit me on the butt this
week. :-) 



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