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From Geertjan Wielenga <geertjan.wiele...@googlemail.com.INVALID>
Subject Re: History of one bug, or what is the attitude of NB devs
Date Tue, 16 Oct 2018 09:20:05 GMT
Just please stop referring to these stupid surveys (do you know anything at
all about who filled in those surveys, for example?) -- NetBeans has a
community of users and that's who we're focused on supporting. If there are
missing features, file a bug report and ideally provide a pull request to
provide the fix.

Thanks,

Gj

On Tue, Oct 16, 2018 at 11:18 AM Geertjan Wielenga <
geertjan.wielenga@googlemail.com> wrote:

>
> On Tue, Oct 16, 2018 at 11:05 AM Tom Arilla <tmarill85@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hopefully I was wrong with the "decreasing popularity", Netbeans seems to
>> rebound
>> https://zeroturnaround.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/06-IntelliJ-IDEA-continues-to-dominate-the-IDE-field-768x683.jpg
>>
>> Le mar. 16 oct. 2018 à 10:54, Tom Arilla <tmarill85@gmail.com> a écrit :
>>
>>> The advantage of Netbeans is (was?) its clean and organized interface.
>>> It is easy to destroy it with ad-hoc, non consulted decisions. I am spammed
>>> 20x a day with "<hammer> Compile on save is disabled. It can be enabled
in
>>> Project Properties". Who came with that interface? I did disable "compile
>>> on save"  to see instantly a list of all compile errors instead of "project
>>> contains errors, run anyway?", a question which I won't even comment.
>>> According to
>>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/32895522/disable-copying-entire-line-when-nothing-is-selected-in-intellij2014-04-gsoc.php
>>> the "copy entire line when no selection" was "the most viewed Intellij
>>> issue". Who just came and remove the option from Netbeans? And told the
>>> people which do not like it "I am sorry"?
>>>
>>> Possibly it is a good idea to concentrate on where Netbeans still shines
>>> and be careful with that. Improve in a consulted way. Devs are different,
>>> not everyone uses Netbeans to build very largr web apps which need "compile
>>> on save" and where almost always statement = single line so copying an
>>> entire line needs a shortcut. Which does not destroy usability for another
>>> dev, not at all, because everyone uses Netbeans to build very large web
>>> apps.
>>>
>>> I can not find the code in question using web search, possibly because
>>> the old forums seem to be gone, but I will look through old source code and
>>> post a patch here. If the option has really been removed and not something
>>> other failed.
>>>
>>>
>>> Le lun. 15 oct. 2018 à 21:06, Emilian Bold <emilian.bold@gmail.com> a
>>> écrit :
>>>
>>>> Every option exponentially increases the states / configurations one
>>>> needs to handle and invites bugs.
>>>>
>>>> So, often times a product will just not do something by design. See the
>>>> great success of iPhone as a testament to this.
>>>>
>>>> But... we are developers! You can make a case for this feature. You can
>>>> write the patch yourself. You can submit it. And... even if it's not
>>>> accepted in the official build -- you can use your own custom NetBeans
>>>> build! It seems very sad to me that companies/developers/users find it so
>>>> unbelievable that you can actually customize your computing environment.
>>>> With a bit of time or money invested you can tweak your perfect cozy little
>>>> bits, just the way you like them.
>>>>
>>>> IntelliJ is a commercial product. On the forums you are a potential
>>>> sale. This changes everything. Last I checked the open-source Community
>>>> Edition didn't even have a proper Javascript editor (it only had basic
>>>> syntax highlighting) -- the good Javascript editor was commercial only. Oh,
>>>> how would things look if a small fraction of NetBeans' users would invest
>>>> the equivalent of an IntelliJ license (89 - 149 euro/year) back into
>>>> NetBeans development.
>>>>
>>>> --emi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 4:12 PM Tom Arilla <tmarill85@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> I am a longtime user of Netbeans and a submitted of many bugs. I see
>>>>> how practically none of them is ever resolved, so that I do not submit
any
>>>>> bug report any more.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am wondering now (as probably many other users, given Netbeans'
>>>>> declining popularity) if to leave, given the (increasing?) number of
>>>>> problems with the IDE. Please help me and explain the history of one
of the
>>>>> many bugs, and why it is like that. Possibly it is a representative of
the
>>>>> current ecosystem around the development of the IDE.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is here https://netbeans.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=192613 and
>>>>> it has 8 years. It is about adding a ridiculously easy option. And about
an
>>>>> option which was there, I but one dev representative who commented
>>>>>
>>>>> This behaviour is intentional. I am sorry you hate it but there are users
who love it. There is no plan to change it.
>>>>>
>>>>> had probably no idea that an option to disable this "behaviour" was
>>>>> already there, several lines of code which were either removed or are
no
>>>>> more functional. I would check it again, but I do not care any more.
Few
>>>>> lines, which I would resubmit as a patch, but when I see a dev answer
like
>>>>> that above, or how I was once ridiculed when I asked about this bug on
the
>>>>> non-existing forum (something about the lines of not fixing it in order
to
>>>>> show who rules here), I do not care any more. Someone reopened that bug
two
>>>>> years ago, but probably no dev cares any more.
>>>>>
>>>>> IntelliJ is somewhat plagued with bugs, but when I browse discussion
>>>>> forums of IntelliJ, there is something encouraging in all that energy
of
>>>>> *helping* the users, of *caring* about them. And we talk about adding
few
>>>>> lines of a ridiculously easy code. Which does not even increase the
>>>>> complexity of the UI. Guess which will be my next IDE.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>

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