From netcat-return-1437-archive-asf-public=cust-asf.ponee.io@netbeans.apache.org Tue Nov 13 23:17:36 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by mx-eu-01.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id 3073518062B for ; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 23:17:35 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 94939 invoked by uid 500); 13 Nov 2018 22:17:34 -0000 Mailing-List: contact netcat-help@netbeans.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Delivered-To: mailing list netcat@netbeans.apache.org Received: (qmail 94851 invoked by uid 99); 13 Nov 2018 22:17:33 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd3-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 22:17:33 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd3-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd3-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 224E918BF48 for ; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 22:17:33 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd3-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.299 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.299 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, HTML_MESSAGE=2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=disabled Received: from mx1-lw-us.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd3-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.10]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5HDTVDQ1L4xx for ; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 22:17:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.18]) by mx1-lw-us.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-us.apache.org) with ESMTPS id 8EE3C62456 for ; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 22:17:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [IPv6:::ffff:192.168.178.40] ([79.211.175.84]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MhAVV-1g9AJc0SWX-00MISw for ; Tue, 13 Nov 2018 23:17:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "netcat@netbeans.apache.org" From: Christian Lenz Subject: AW: [DISCUSS] Apache NetBeans roadmap updates Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 23:17:21 +0100 Importance: normal X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: <6c715fc4-fd7f-57e1-fda3-68c15bc68d37@gmail.com> References: <6c715fc4-fd7f-57e1-fda3-68c15bc68d37@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_E2D4707B-CFE8-4ECA-A6DE-6B842CC1E593_" Message-ID: <0MFMEG-1gJRKP1QWK-00EQGd@mail.gmx.com> X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:SynTDqN33WMo7OMqAa1mDBw8SiQblfl2R+sIreWbptc+3XkEPZq a2MxgKE3xU2Cu77g+uNPGMyBJs/GPxC1X9VhptDMp4I3v2Sq/p7I4gxL/LC27czHye4DGxk tGGhRDaFp07W4+aFhx37/+3F6Ji8Fh9HJiO5vHB9WGqOaCW/MbjBP0NUuFUUp80QYiSq0o/ yH1OCudwT4hLuO44n1YAw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:gxHCrdjVYpU=:xPS+yZPgNIkfWLAdELP/7p Cw7dPgiUc0e1UkSSwMgDcaqEtWrh/6Cc2Tc1aNDkgFy6B6deZ2KWPJYz5jgQaoOTinaqBBpnY PLWPPdXPNwI4uWocfPFg4mCFqquZKUYMyemF20hljDvSmJRwiOR2P19Cxs5oxpoyI+h9hqCuG 2JtYXoAohz9s/tLAY3dJTRCYbecgpIzQ5WkQTTw8v2rn78jfw+vT1AxGmh5x2D4h0Hk4IJNaP W/5Oa7OuCx9sLUesf8RQPJl5Nr5iZxUCL3efFOHWHUQU/3yoB5IqKXxdynsicxJF1dDvyFTXU hfUQGKF0HdYq5SDsWi5RS8S5/saeXqpADB1/Ep/ZtVCOAgxrr4bLUjsnfrN/+TGk2IaDuYCXC bzQJV9cQqq8iMYY69oXIOSuemS9ek8JDt6dCUG7eTJ6XWqOMcIBnDA/xQ16hegsk1Z4EJNeIy 6HrvcbxfSJQCpoWNpxK3P2iI/PCUjyJJN1Ttu+HRHIV1NhjcSJXYgnaJXkSjTfBFCUf1NDWYQ mIWch8ISINO1CUlKGGzxCj4nHxPDhfGiF+ZqUH3bDxVkZiyzxMt98ypUTrC1dDaJ/TNBe5HKP SaAd0wjBNjPUbkIpRCuru4BjWEz4zRxfMMfjDgovReTy/GBhFAc6oJIEv/Pe4d0olrBc7eIoE /24k9anSZTr6XLV2FeU0qoDqNNG8oTxjPz5sCc1KH5BNzPkFHeHIpEL5Fi+AJM4vRVDQWAgpm 1OuWtn918Lhr6S7+phrTqoO91/bdhHoX1Bl4a57Kky3teEgl9rMkm6AxWu6dSa/b2fdqnx/9K DHJxz0hzeOb41LjchIrFs08gc2ha5hx5DP1J5GF+maRspnCv7DKFN5PWVEECzz4RWcHESH8EF TEOGgIe8zHHiTPFHvoFFGnjgS4l7CmXuxTtWfsx9wnURdlQQzbfLnNSCQgwUw38jP3sSW53sN UOe8gEa6HfA== --_E2D4707B-CFE8-4ECA-A6DE-6B842CC1E593_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" -1 for only 2 releases per year. This is far to less and will end up with t= he Oracle model, where we only have 2 releases per year (Round About, look = at the Roadmaps, you see often big time between a new release and an old on= e). We will not be competitive to other IDEs, we are still now lack of a lo= t of Features (Little ones, which make everyone happy and Handy and big one= s). IMHO the biggest Problem now with the NetCat is still the donation proc= ess. I guess, it will be less problematic after we have everything in Apach= e and completed donation. To put it back to the JDK Version is also not good, again only IMHO, becaus= e NetBeans is still not a Java DIE anymore we should remove this thinking w= hich is still in the heads of a lot of developers. And to put that thinking= away, NetBeans Needs more advertisement of the other Features and more imp= lementation of stuff, which is still missing (Angular, Vue, JSON Schema, ot= her language supports, etc.) How will the Patches look like? Only bug fixes? What About Major Releases l= ike 11, 12, 13 and in between 11.1, 11.2 with new Features? I mean we can have 11 in Feb and 12 in I don=E2=80=99t know August which is= 6 Months and in between we should have 11.1 and 11.2 which is not only a b= ugfix for a lot of Bugs, also with new Features, but not that big. So Maybe= no NetCat for 11.1 and 11.2 or not that much time spending on that. Maybe = reducing the NetCat process or changing it? Come one, there can be a lot mo= re stuff to make it better and possible. I know and this is a big Benefit, = that NetBeans is real stable. I switched from Eclipse now 5 years ago to Ne= tBeans, because of 2 simple Plugins of Eclipse, that broke the whole IDE. I= know that we Need that Quality. So IntelliJ or the JetBrains based IDEs ar= e also real stable. So I think we can handle it. And no, using the development Version is not an Option, they are often not = stable and not possible to use it in production. I tried it from 7.0 =E2=80= =93 7.2 I end up with a nightly build with a lot of NPE after starting the = DIE so I had to go back tot the stable Version and had to wait 3 more month= s for the new Fancy Features. Agian, I think after the donation process, it will be more easy, so we shou= ld wait a whole year 2019 to see what happens then and should discuss it ag= ain after the last release of 2019. We should not overreact yet. My 2 cents Cheers Chris Von: Laszlo Kishalmi Gesendet: Dienstag, 13. November 2018 18:08 An: netcat@netbeans.apache.org Betreff: Re: [DISCUSS] Apache NetBeans roadmap updates Well, it is not that simple. Having major plugins to have their own release means that you shall=20 replicate at least some of the release infrastructure/process/people=20 work for it. On the other hand one of the greatest values of NetBeans is that it just=20 works out of the box. Having some plugins create their own releases=20 means moving to the Eclipse model as plugins might creating frictions=20 from release to release between each other and the IDE. I had to listen=20 countless discussions of my colleges which version of eclipse to use=20 with which version of plugins, until the Eclipse distribution creators=20 showed up. So I would not go that route. Having two releases per year with 3 month patch releases sounds fair to me. For those who want the new and shiny, there was always a possibility to=20 use the development version. =C2=A0On 11/13/18 8:03 AM, Alexander Romanenko wrote: > Sorry if this was discussed before and I missed it. > Are there any reasons why major plugins cannot have their own release > schedule? From org perspective, i think (1) puts less pressure on testers > to test all features at once, including ones they are not familiar with. > (2) less pressure from users about not having access to plugins that are > "complete" months ago but have to wait for arbitrary global release date. > > =D0=B2=D1=82, 13 =D0=BD=D0=BE=D1=8F=D0=B1. 2018 =D0=B3. =D0=B2 9:59, Neil= C Smith : > >> On Tue, 13 Nov 2018, 14:16 Emilian Bold > >>> Two releases per year seems more manageable. >>> >> The point of 4 was to be more manageable though. Less changes, less >> pressure for new features to meet deadlines (dropping 3 months less of a= n >> issue) >> >> I'm happy with either, but I don't think the current situation with lots= of >> changes / things still being donated is a good model for how this might >> work once the dust settles. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> Neil >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: netcat-unsubscribe@netbeans.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: netcat-help@netbeans.apache.org For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists --_E2D4707B-CFE8-4ECA-A6DE-6B842CC1E593_--