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From: Neil C Smith <neilcsmith.net@googlemail.com>
Date: Sat, 5 Nov 2016 18:00:02 +0000
Message-ID: <CAHvRSodGvLsLSgpMzB9wzTfdHfk1YahvO4ex=mqcsM25C0j4tw@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Optional modules with GPL dependencies (was: What to
 include/exclude in code donation to Apache)
To: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
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archived-at: Sat, 05 Nov 2016 18:00:30 -0000

Hi,

Is top-posting or inline replying the norm here?  Anyway, replies below :-)

>> On Nov 5, 2016, at 12:22, Wade Chandler <wadechandler@apache.org> wrote:
>> I think there is =E2=80=9Cwhat can be at Apache; source or built artifac=
ts=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cwhat can my platform application include in its fi=
nal build; which isn=E2=80=99t at Apache; even if it uses an Apache license=
=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Chow can Apache NetBeans help me package my dependenc=
ies, per my choices, regardless of Apache=E2=80=99s business and legal deci=
sions for their own products/projects=E2=80=9D. I think these are inevitabl=
y going to be part of the concerns, and perhaps some of yours Neil; if I=E2=
=80=99m off base, then fine.

Not really ...

> On 5 November 2016 at 16:45, Wade Chandler <wadechandler@apache.org> wrot=
e:
> Perhaps specific threads can be created to discuss the Java and JavaScrip=
t support in NetBeans (independently/maybe together). I think a big part of=
 the question is what does Oracle think about supporting nb-javac and graal=
.js if they are only used by NetBeans. I mean, is there some long term supp=
ort strategy there?

This is more my concern, and reason for the questions I raised.  I
realise my use of the words "this project" may have been open to
misinterpretation - I meant NetBeans, not my own platform application
(although that is obviously of tangential concern for me!).  I should
have said, having the regular OpenJDK tooling supporting what NetBeans
requires surely benefits all projects building similar tools.

My concern is that without the Java cluster I don't believe NetBeans
is really a viable project, and for that cluster to be viable requires
the long term support of nb-javac that you mention.  Why I think this
is different to reliance on almost any other library is the way javac
uses the internals of the JRE.  eg. the last time I looked, javac had
specific exceptions in place to bypass module restrictions in Java 9.
It just feels like shakier ground to rely on than it could be.

Assuming the answer to my licensing question is no, then I'm
interested in exactly how much nb-javac forks from javac and how
maintainable it is from outside?  Could nb-javac features be merged
with javac, or become ide-javac within OpenJDK, providing similar
services to any IDE?

My 2c!

Best wishes,

Neil

--=20
Neil C Smith
Artist & Technologist
www.neilcsmith.net

Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org