Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-myfaces-dev-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 78952 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2008 20:50:13 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (140.211.11.2) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 7 Apr 2008 20:50:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 68962 invoked by uid 500); 7 Apr 2008 20:50:12 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-myfaces-dev-archive@myfaces.apache.org Received: (qmail 68932 invoked by uid 500); 7 Apr 2008 20:50:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@myfaces.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: "MyFaces Development" Delivered-To: mailing list dev@myfaces.apache.org Received: (qmail 68921 invoked by uid 99); 7 Apr 2008 20:50:11 -0000 Received: from athena.apache.org (HELO athena.apache.org) (140.211.11.136) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 07 Apr 2008 13:50:11 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=10.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of hazem.saleh@gmail.com designates 209.85.200.170 as permitted sender) Received: from [209.85.200.170] (HELO wf-out-1314.google.com) (209.85.200.170) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 07 Apr 2008 20:49:37 +0000 Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 29so1694347wff.24 for ; Mon, 07 Apr 2008 13:49:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=98f3yOIUDZMa/nz5oXJ/bgfUOZamTRJ1kNl7INshLY0=; b=qTZ/iUzI+rCQc6jOlIQcZmwqEA+8xiqRyfqyVK3aJaXnKCYok7S3nuDda+9upV7hQgcGHhJxdXjFnwx4wTHbP2VIKo8MgvKsjYLe395D5uQaPl4bP6pp28ohwgiotknM0wHfNJjdaaGX03y28NpAkuwXpCW9m4w0e61oZJqoi7g= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=TTdYqa6XNiovlfOkrcSDlSSFwNI2rEBeh/wEQUj39a38VQ7vhMp1BHEC8UyUbaJkS3OS65KEY4qvlPOMjQ58J2qcyq2aiSkG1yBFkwyO6/ABxXLqejSj+rCBb5ngxmClkvxMWuHj+EiN7PmS/LYHaToI1UjfADV7ainww2XtAx4= Received: by 10.143.163.3 with SMTP id q3mr1406915wfo.305.1207601390040; Mon, 07 Apr 2008 13:49:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.161.18 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Apr 2008 13:49:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <24d690cd0804071349n245fa0fcye8669efd51dcd101@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2008 22:49:49 +0200 From: "Hazem Saleh" To: "MyFaces Development" Subject: Re: [proposal] jsf validation with annotations In-Reply-To: <2332f63b0804071324x2d74944ch96b0abd23cb9a6ed@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_17436_10737476.1207601390015" References: <2332f63b0804031311o36731d4budd9895e734c9ecc7@mail.gmail.com> <2332f63b0804040956o728d03f8tf33dd8725080ea67@mail.gmail.com> <004301c8967f$564f7500$02ee5f00$@com> <2332f63b0804041147x2d902be3lf763c68bfebc0fae@mail.gmail.com> <000e01c89685$cd9d8b50$68d8a1f0$@com> <8c9d4eaa0804041213r382ea151k4276e88c4e1f4af2@mail.gmail.com> <2332f63b0804050502qab81254n82b484c4f449c45e@mail.gmail.com> <24d690cd0804071038n2ceb0527x2d1633cb09308d5d@mail.gmail.com> <2332f63b0804071324x2d74944ch96b0abd23cb9a6ed@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org ------=_Part_17436_10737476.1207601390015 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hello, Iam just suggesting a standard way of validation that we are going to implement in the next days which can be useful later for JSF or EJB projects. This project is currently a subproject of the apache commons project. IMHO if sev-en can support JSR-303 annotations, this will be great! Thank you. On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Gerhard Petracek < gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote: > hello, > > (the sev-en core doesn't provide specific annotations. > maybe there will be an annotation module to support jsr 303 annotations, > which might act as adapter for the project you mentioned.) > > or are you suggesting to publish sev-en as a sub-project of the commons > project? > > regards, > gerhard > > > > 2008/4/7, Hazem Saleh : > > > Hi All... > > > > There is already an ongoing activity to implement JSR#303 - > > http://www.jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=303 - and we started it as an Apache > > Commons Sandbox project. Following links for discussion threads and the svn > > repo of the new project: > > > > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.jakarta.commons.devel/102655 > > > > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.jakarta.commons.devel/102683 > > > > http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/commons/sandbox/validator2/ > > > > IMHO this will be a good base for more specific validation requirements, > > like JSF or EJB specific validations. > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 2:02 PM, Gerhard Petracek < > > gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > hello cagatay, > > > > > > i see your point. however, i don't agree. to keep it short: > > > i don't like the idea to restrict sev-en to orchestra. > > > > > > don't get me wrong - orchestra is really great! > > > however, it isn't alone out there. > > > (e.g. spring web flow and much more) > > > > > > if sev-en is a goody or not is in the eye of the beholder. > > > i would say e.g.: the possible jpa support is a goody of sev-en. > > > (the core of sev-en doesn't depend on jpa or something else. the core > > > depends only on the jsf api and at the moment on commons-logging ;)) > > > > > > regards, > > > gerhard > > > > > > > > > > > > 2008/4/4, Cagatay Civici : > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I think Orchestra is kinda out of it's original scope, Mario and > > > > Simon couldn't resist and add many cool useful features like viewController, > > > > dynaForm and more that are not related to conversations and persistence. > > > > > > > > Orchestra is becoming our alternative to seam, sev-en is a goodie > > > > right? So rather than a seperate project, I've no problem if it gets merged > > > > in Orchestra, just my 2 cents, it's up to further discussion. > > > > > > > > Cagatay > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Kito D. Mann > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *From:* Gerhard Petracek [mailto:gerhard.petracek@gmail.com] > > > > > *Sent:* Friday, April 04, 2008 2:47 PM > > > > > *To:* MyFaces Development; kmann@virtua.com > > > > > *Subject:* Re: [proposal] jsf validation with annotations > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hello kito, > > > > > > > > > > you can put every extension into a "commons" module. > > > > > > > > > > I see what you're saying. I suppose the main issue is the size of > > > > > the module, and the number of perceived users. > > > > > > > > > > To be honest, I think Tomahawk is a better place for it, since > > > > > Tomahawk contains a lot of stuff that belongs in the JSF core, like some > > > > > basic validators. > > > > > > > > > > orchestra is about conversations and persistence > > > > > and > > > > > sev-en is about validation (simple and cross-component validation) > > > > > at the moment i'm not aware of the difference. > > > > > > > > > > it might be ok to put specific sev-en annotation modules into the > > > > > commons module (as i said - they are independent of the sev-en core). > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > gerhard > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2008/4/4, Kito D. Mann : > > > > > > > > > > Gerhard, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, it's different. Commons is a collection of useful > > > > > utilities and features. Think of it in terms of the Apache Commons. > > > > > Orchestra is about conversations and persistence contexts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > > Kito D. Mann - Author, JavaServer Faces in Action > > > > > http://www.virtua.com - JSF/Java EE consulting, training, and > > > > > mentoring > > > > > http://www.JSFCentral.com - > > > > > JavaServer Faces FAQ, news, and info > > > > > phone: +1 203-653-2989 > > > > > fax: +1 203-653-2988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *From:* Gerhard Petracek [mailto:gerhard.petracek@gmail.com] > > > > > *Sent:* Friday, April 04, 2008 12:56 PM > > > > > *To:* MyFaces Development > > > > > *Subject:* Re: [proposal] jsf validation with annotations > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hello leonardo, > > > > > > > > > > concerning myfaces-commons-sev-en: > > > > > i don't agree. it's similar if you suggest to merge > > > > > myfaces-orchestra with myfaces-commons. - in my opinion that's not a good > > > > > idea. > > > > > sev-en should stay independent! > > > > > > > > > > + commons-sev-en sounds strage. :) > > > > > (the pronunciation isn't [sev] ... [en] - it's like the 7 in > > > > > english) > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > gerhard > > > > > > > > > > 2008/4/4, Leonardo Uribe : > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have tried the demo on my workstation, and in my opinion is a > > > > > very cool idea and this should be on myfaces :) > > > > > > > > > > The idea of include with myfaces-commons sounds better that put > > > > > this on orchestra (someone could want to use this only). Maybe > > > > > myfaces-commons-sev-en. > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Leonardo Uribe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 11:02 AM, Gerhard Petracek < > > > > > gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > hello andrew, > > > > > > > > > > sev-en is completely independent of orchestra or the idea behind > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > gerhard > > > > > > > > > > 2008/4/4, Andrew Robinson : > > > > > > > > > > Since this is currently supported in Seam and Orchestra is a Seam > > > > > spin-off/clone, perhaps this should be incorporated into Orchestra > > > > > instead of yet another project. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 4:45 AM, Matthias Wessendorf < > > > > > matzew@apache.org> wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 10:11 PM, Gerhard Petracek > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > sev-en is a new jsf-extension. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sev-en allows jsf validation with annotations! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some central features: > > > > > > > - cross-component validation (including cross-entity > > > > > validation) > > > > > > > - support for jpa based validation > > > > > > > - zero configuration > > > > > > > - extensible (e.g. custom annotations) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you will find some previews (descriptions [1], examples [2] > > > > > and much more) > > > > > > > at the sev-en section [3] of my new open source blog. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > what's your opinion about this extension? > > > > > > > > > > > > sounds interesting. Is that levering the "bean validation" JSR > > > > > ? > > > > > > Would be cool to have a little bit more standard oriented > > > > > validation > > > > > > "framework". > > > > > > Otherwise (IMO) that would be just something similar to > > > > > @Hibernate's validators > > > > > > (used heavily in Seam) > > > > > > > > > > > > -M > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > gerhard > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [1] http://os890.blogspot.com/2008/03/new-jsf-extension.html > > > > > > > [2] > > > > > http://os890.blogspot.com/2008/04/sev-en-preview-short-example.html > > > > > > > [3] http://os890.blogspot.com/search/label/sev-en > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.irian.at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your JSF powerhouse - > > > > > > > JSF Consulting, Development and > > > > > > > Courses in English and German > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Matthias Wessendorf > > > > > > > > > > > > further stuff: > > > > > > blog: http://matthiaswessendorf.wordpress.com/ > > > > > > sessions: http://www.slideshare.net/mwessendorf > > > > > > mail: matzew-at-apache-dot-org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.irian.at > > > > > > > > > > Your JSF powerhouse - > > > > > JSF Consulting, Development and > > > > > Courses in English and German > > > > > > > > > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > http://www.irian.at > > > > > > > > > > Your JSF powerhouse - > > > > > JSF Consulting, Development and > > > > > Courses in English and German > > > > > > > > > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > http://www.irian.at > > > > > > > > > > Your JSF powerhouse - > > > > > JSF Consulting, Development and > > > > > Courses in English and German > > > > > > > > > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > http://www.irian.at > > > > > > Your JSF powerhouse - > > > JSF Consulting, Development and > > > Courses in English and German > > > > > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Hazem Ahmed Saleh Ahmed > > http://www.jroller.com/page/HazemBlog > > > > > -- > > http://www.irian.at > > Your JSF powerhouse - > JSF Consulting, Development and > Courses in English and German > > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces > -- Hazem Ahmed Saleh Ahmed http://www.jroller.com/page/HazemBlog ------=_Part_17436_10737476.1207601390015 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hello,
Iam just suggesting a standard way of validation that we are going to implement in the next days which can be useful later for JSF or EJB projects.
This project is currently a subproject of the apache commons project.
IMHO if sev-en can support JSR-303 annotations, this will be great!
Thank you.


On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Gerhard Petracek <gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote:
hello,

(the sev-en core doesn't provide specific annotations.
maybe there will be an annotation module to support jsr 303 annotations, which might act as adapter for the project you mentioned.)

or are you suggesting to publish sev-en as a sub-project of the commons project?

regards,
gerhard



2008/4/7, Hazem Saleh <hazem.saleh@gmail.com>:
Hi All...

  There is already an ongoing activity to implement JSR#303 - http://www.jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=303 - and we started it as an Apache Commons Sandbox project. Following links for discussion threads and the svn repo of the new project:

http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.jakarta.commons.devel/102655

http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.jakarta.commons.devel/102683

http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/commons/sandbox/validator2/

IMHO this will be a good base for more specific validation requirements, like JSF or EJB specific validations.



On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 2:02 PM, Gerhard Petracek <gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote:
hello cagatay,

i see your point. however, i don't agree. to keep it short:
i don't like the idea to restrict sev-en to orchestra.

don't get me wrong - orchestra is really great!
however, it isn't alone out there.
(e.g. spring web flow and much more)

if sev-en is a goody or not is in the eye of the beholder.
i would say e.g.: the possible jpa support is a goody of sev-en.
(the core of sev-en doesn't depend on jpa or something else. the core depends only on the jsf api and at the moment on commons-logging ;))

regards,
gerhard



2008/4/4, Cagatay Civici <cagatay.civici@gmail.com>:
Hi,

I think Orchestra is kinda out of it's original scope, Mario and Simon couldn't resist and add many cool useful features like viewController, dynaForm and more that are not related to conversations and persistence.

Orchestra is becoming our alternative to seam, sev-en is a goodie right? So rather than a seperate project, I've no problem if it gets merged in Orchestra, just my 2 cents, it's up to further discussion.

Cagatay


On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Kito D. Mann <kmann@virtua.com> wrote:

 

From: Gerhard Petracek [mailto:gerhard.petracek@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 2:47 PM
To: MyFaces Development; kmann@virtua.com


Subject: Re: [proposal] jsf validation with annotations

 

hello kito,

you can put every extension into a "commons" module.

I see what you're saying. I suppose the main issue is the size of the module, and the number of perceived users.

To be honest, I think Tomahawk is a better place for it, since Tomahawk contains a lot of stuff that belongs in the JSF core, like some basic validators.


orchestra is about conversations and persistence
and
sev-en is about validation (simple and cross-component validation)
at the moment i'm not aware of the difference.

it might be ok to put specific sev-en annotation modules into the commons module (as i said - they are independent of the sev-en core).

regards,
gerhard


2008/4/4, Kito D. Mann <kmann@virtua.com>:

Gerhard,

 

Actually, it's different. Commons is a collection of useful utilities and features. Think of it in terms of the Apache Commons. Orchestra is about conversations and persistence contexts.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Kito D. Mann - Author, JavaServer Faces in Action
http://www.virtua.com - JSF/Java EE consulting, training, and mentoring
http://www.JSFCentral.com - JavaServer Faces FAQ, news, and info
phone: +1 203-653-2989
fax: +1 203-653-2988

 

From: Gerhard Petracek [mailto:gerhard.petracek@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, April 04, 2008 12:56 PM
To: MyFaces Development
Subject: Re: [proposal] jsf validation with annotations

 

hello leonardo,

concerning myfaces-commons-sev-en:
i don't agree. it's similar if you suggest to merge myfaces-orchestra with myfaces-commons. - in my opinion that's not a good idea.
sev-en should stay independent!

+ commons-sev-en sounds strage. :)
(the pronunciation isn't [sev] ... [en] - it's like the 7 in english)

regards,
gerhard

2008/4/4, Leonardo Uribe <lu4242@gmail.com>:


I have tried the demo on my workstation, and in my opinion is a very cool idea and this should be on myfaces :)

The idea of include with myfaces-commons sounds better that put this on orchestra (someone could want to use this only). Maybe myfaces-commons-sev-en.

regards

Leonardo Uribe

 

On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 11:02 AM, Gerhard Petracek <gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote:

hello andrew,

sev-en is completely independent of orchestra or the idea behind it.

regards,
gerhard

2008/4/4, Andrew Robinson <andrew.rw.robinson@gmail.com>:

Since this is currently supported in Seam and Orchestra is a Seam
spin-off/clone, perhaps this should be incorporated into Orchestra
instead of yet another project.


On Fri, Apr 4, 2008 at 4:45 AM, Matthias Wessendorf <matzew@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
>  On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 10:11 PM, Gerhard Petracek
>  <gerhard.petracek@gmail.com> wrote:
>  > sev-en is a new jsf-extension.
>  >
>  > sev-en allows jsf validation with annotations!
>  >
>  > some central features:
>  > - cross-component validation (including cross-entity validation)
>  >  - support for jpa based validation
>  > - zero configuration
>  > - extensible (e.g. custom annotations)
>  >
>  > you will find some previews (descriptions [1], examples [2] and much more)
>  > at the sev-en section [3] of my new open source blog.
>  >
>  > what's your opinion about this extension?
>
>  sounds interesting. Is that levering the "bean validation" JSR ?
>  Would be cool to have a little bit more standard oriented validation
>  "framework".
>  Otherwise (IMO) that would be just something similar to @Hibernate's validators
>  (used heavily in Seam)
>
>  -M
>
>
>
>  >
>  > regards,
>  > gerhard
>  >
>  > [1] http://os890.blogspot.com/2008/03/new-jsf-extension.html
>  > [2] http://os890.blogspot.com/2008/04/sev-en-preview-short-example.html
>  >  [3] http://os890.blogspot.com/search/label/sev-en
>  >
>  > --
>  >
>  > http://www.irian.at
>  >
>  > Your JSF powerhouse -
>  > JSF Consulting, Development and
>  >  Courses in English and German
>  >
>  > Professional Support for Apache MyFaces
>
>
>
>  --
>  Matthias Wessendorf
>
>  further stuff:
>  blog: http://matthiaswessendorf.wordpress.com/
>  sessions: http://www.slideshare.net/mwessendorf
>  mail: matzew-at-apache-dot-org
>




--


http://www.irian.at

Your JSF powerhouse -
JSF Consulting, Development and
Courses in English and German

Professional Support for Apache MyFaces

 




--

http://www.irian.at

Your JSF powerhouse -
JSF Consulting, Development and
Courses in English and German

Professional Support for Apache MyFaces




--

http://www.irian.at

Your JSF powerhouse -
JSF Consulting, Development and
Courses in English and German

Professional Support for Apache MyFaces





--

http://www.irian.at

Your JSF powerhouse -
JSF Consulting, Development and
Courses in English and German

Professional Support for Apache MyFaces



--
Hazem Ahmed Saleh Ahmed
http://www.jroller.com/page/HazemBlog



--

http://www.irian.at

Your JSF powerhouse -
JSF Consulting, Development and
Courses in English and German

Professional Support for Apache MyFaces



--
Hazem Ahmed Saleh Ahmed
http://www.jroller.com/page/HazemBlog ------=_Part_17436_10737476.1207601390015--