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From Bob Paulin <...@bobpaulin.com>
Subject Re: [Discussion] Recognise Reviewers, Besides Committers and PMC
Date Tue, 23 Oct 2018 14:08:31 GMT
Generally if a person is trusted to review code they should be
considered as a committer.  Agree that having good reviewers are
important but the way most projects recognize those efforts is by making
them committers.


- Bob


On 10/22/2018 5:23 PM, Chris Olivier wrote:
> Are there any other major Apache projects which have this designation?  I
> am always continually suspicious of efforts to reinvent Apache rules from
> other non-Apache projects, when Apache projects have historically been
> quite successful within the Apache platform.  In fact, operating outside of
> Apache norms is already a major problem as everyone knows.  We are only
> just now splitting Committer/PMC into two separate groups. Splitting into
> three seems a bit much at this juncture unless there's some good precedents.
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 2:17 PM Tianqi Chen <tqchen@apache.org> wrote:
>
>> The situation most projects are facing(including us), is lack of code
>> reviews. Code reviews are the most important part of the project, and
>> high-quality reviews are extremely time-consuming, maybe as much as so
>> as the code itself. Usually, it is only committers do the code reviews, the
>> code reviews from committers are important, as they are the serve as
>> the gate-keeper of the quality of the code.  In my experience, I
>> usually find the reviews from non-committer super helpful, and they
>> help the committer to catch problems that are otherwise overlooked.
>>
>> However, it is very hard to get contributors to do code reviews unless we
>> solicit them. It is definitely harder than getting code contributions.  The
>> Reviewer mechanism could provide a way to do so. We can recognize
>> contributors, bring them as reviewers and encourage them to do the code
>> reviews by explicitly soliciting. The reviewers can learn from the
>> committer reviews,
>> which serves as a role model for what is being expected. Naturally, this
>> likely helps us find more good reviewers and bought them committer.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Tianqi
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 1:09 PM Anirudh <anirudh2290@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> -1. I dont see the need for additional level of hierarchy. I totally am
>> for
>>> recognizing good code reviewers. We can recognize this by making them
>>> committers. Being a good reviewer should be sufficient to become a
>>> committer in my opinion. (Assuming that there is a seperation between
>> PPMC
>>> and committers).
>>>
>>> Anirudh
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 8:28 AM Qing Lan <lanking520@live.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> +1
>>>> Let's have a reviewer list somewhere with a certain format: such as
>> C++,
>>>> Gluon, Scala/Java based on language or some other category. etc. In the
>>>> future, label bot would automatically assign reviewers based on this
>> kind
>>>> of documentation.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Qing
>>>>
>>>> On 10/21/18, 11:44 PM, "YiZhi Liu" <eazhi.liu@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     +1
>>>>     I also suggest add reviewer list link to the PR template, so that
>>>>     developers can easily request review from those reviewers.
>>>>     On Sun, Oct 21, 2018 at 8:30 PM Tianqi Chen <tqchen@apache.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>>     >
>>>>     > I was suggesting something more concrete:
>>>>     >
>>>>     > - Add a Reviewers section to
>>>>     >
>>>> https://github.com/apache/incubator-mxnet/blob/master/CONTRIBUTORS.md
>> to
>>>>     > list a list of Reviewers.
>>>>     >     - This is a "pesudo role", but holds weight as committers
>>> should
>>>> highly
>>>>     > value their reviews during the PR process.
>>>>     > - The committers/PMC could actively look for good contributors
>> and
>>>> nominate
>>>>     > them as Reviewer.
>>>>     > - Contributors are encouraged to seek reviews from the list of
>>>> reviewers.
>>>>     > - The committers should actively solicit code reviews from the
>>>> reviewers
>>>>     > when reviewing PRs and take their reviews into serious
>>> consideration.
>>>>     >
>>>>     > - PMCs should actively look for new committers in the current
>>>> Reviewers
>>>>     >    - Notably, the history reviews plus contribution likely will
>>>> provide a
>>>>     > good indication on whether the person can uphold the quality
>>>> standard of
>>>>     > the codebase, and provide helpful feedbacks(which is the trait
>> that
>>>> needed
>>>>     > from committer to merge code)
>>>>     >
>>>>     > Tianqi
>>>>     >
>>>>     >
>>>>     > On Sun, Oct 21, 2018 at 5:13 PM Steffen Rochel <
>>>> steffenrochel@gmail.com>
>>>>     > wrote:
>>>>     >
>>>>     > > +1
>>>>     > > With the release announcement for MXNet 1.3 all contributors
>>> incl.
>>>> code
>>>>     > > reviewers have been recognized. I suggest all future release
>>>> announcements
>>>>     > > should include such recognition. Are you suggesting to
>> highlight
>>>> most
>>>>     > > active reviewers in release announcement or regularly (e.g.
>>>> monthly),
>>>>     > > specifically from non-committers?
>>>>     > >
>>>>     > > On Sun, Oct 21, 2018 at 10:11 AM Tianqi Chen <
>> tqchen@apache.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>     > >
>>>>     > > > Also re another email-thread(I sent out one with my
>>>> institutional email
>>>>     > > > which get blocked initially, so this one was a bit
>> duplication
>>>> of that).
>>>>     > > I
>>>>     > > > think it should really be the job of committers to recognize
>>>> potential
>>>>     > > > reviewers, github also makes it easier to do so, e.g.
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > >
>>>>
>> https://github.com/apache/incubator-mxnet/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=reviewed-by%3Apiiswrong
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > > > Tianqi
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > > > On Fri, Oct 19, 2018 at 12:05 PM Carin Meier <
>>>> carinmeier@gmail.com>
>>>>     > > wrote:
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > > > > +1 Great idea. Adding a name to the contributor list
is a
>>> good
>>>> idea.
>>>>     > > > Also,
>>>>     > > > > I've found that thanking the person for the review
on the
>> PR
>>>> is another
>>>>     > > > way
>>>>     > > > > to express gratitude for their time and effort.
>>>>     > > > >
>>>>     > > > > On Fri, Oct 19, 2018 at 2:51 PM Tianqi Chen <
>>> tqchen@apache.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>     > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > Dear MXNet Community:
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > There is a great discussion going on in terms
of lowering
>>>> the barrier
>>>>     > > > of
>>>>     > > > > > entries and encourage more contribution to the
project.
>>> One
>>>> of the
>>>>     > > > > general
>>>>     > > > > > goals is to encourage a broader pool of contributions.
I
>>>> want to make
>>>>     > > > the
>>>>     > > > > > following proposal:
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > Besides Committers and PMC, let us also recognize
>> Reviewers
>>>> in the
>>>>     > > > > > community.  This is a "pseudo role" as there
is no such
>>>> official role
>>>>     > > > in
>>>>     > > > > > Apache. But I want to explore the possibility
of
>>> recognizing
>>>> active
>>>>     > > > > > reviewers for example, by adding a list of names
in the
>>>> contributor
>>>>     > > > list.
>>>>     > > > > > In general, I find it is really helpful to have
more code
>>>> reviews.
>>>>     > > > > > Recognizing good reviewers early enables us
to find
>>> committer
>>>>     > > > candidates,
>>>>     > > > > > and encourage them to contribute and understand
what is
>> the
>>>> bar of
>>>>     > > code
>>>>     > > > > > quality that is required to merge the code.
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > This can provide the community with more evidence
when
>>>> recruiting new
>>>>     > > > > > committers. After all the write access of committership
>> is
>>>> about to
>>>>     > > the
>>>>     > > > > > code and understand the consequence of the responsibility
>>> --
>>>> which is
>>>>     > > > > > usually can be found in high-quality review
history.
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > Please let me know what you think.
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > > > Tianqi
>>>>     > > > > >
>>>>     > > > >
>>>>     > > >
>>>>     > >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     --
>>>>     Yizhi Liu
>>>>     DMLC member
>>>>     Amazon Web Services
>>>>     Vancouver, Canada
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>



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