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From Sheng Zha <szha....@gmail.com>
Subject Re: [RESULT][VOTE] tracking code changes with JIRA by associating pull requests
Date Thu, 08 Mar 2018 17:44:49 GMT
Cool. Feel free to propose a change to the PR template.

How would JIRA be less daunting to new users?

-sz

> On Mar 8, 2018, at 9:25 AM, Chris Olivier <cjolivier01@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> My $0.02 about the PR template.
> 
> I think it's a good idea.  I think (just my opinion) is that the adoption
> is low because it started out too big and daunting.  It may get more
> adoption if we started a little smaller -- with maybe two checkboxes" and
> also didn't have a line at the top stating "Description", because that feel
> skind of awkward and github inserts extended label info above it sometimes.
> 
> Just an idea.
> 
>> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 9:13 AM, Sheng Zha <szha.pvg@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> The PR template is designed for that and its poor adoption is causing the
>> same issue of missing information in PRs. My concern of using JIRA is that
>> more overhead would deter contribution and worsen the quality of
>> description.
>> 
>> -sz
>> 
>>> On Mar 8, 2018, at 8:49 AM, Nan Zhu <zhunanmcgill@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> +1 on both suggestions
>>> 
>>> a bit concern is on the quality of JIRA which is created automatically
>>> 
>>> I can see a lot of PRs are not described comprehensively, if we just post
>>> what in description to JIRA, it's error-propagating
>>> 
>>> 
>>> but the quality of JIRA is a big topic worth more discussions
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 3:06 AM, Marco de Abreu <
>> marco.g.abreu@googlemail.com
>>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Would it be possible to automatically create JIRA tickets when a GitHub
>>>> issue is being created? We could then mirror all comments the same way
>> it's
>>>> happening in https://issues.apache.org/jira/projects/MXNET/issues/
>> MXNET-42
>>>> but make sure that the bot works in both ways. A comment on GitHub
>> would be
>>>> copied to JIRA and a JIRA comment to GitHub. I think this would be good
>> as
>>>> a first step to start integration.
>>>> 
>>>> -Marco
>>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 8:08 PM, Marco de Abreu <
>>>> marco.g.abreu@googlemail.com
>>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I also see this as a big advantage in terms of transparency. I
>> personally
>>>>> will try to move away from any company internal issue trackers (except
>>>> for
>>>>> confidential cases) and instead work on Jira that is being managed by
>> the
>>>>> community. This allows everybody to see what is being worked on and
>> gives
>>>>> them the possibility to chime with ideas or suggestions.
>>>>> 
>>>>> In my opinion, this obsoletes TT and SIM to a big extent. It's up to
>> you
>>>>> if you maintain multiple issue trackers or stick to one. If anybody
>> has a
>>>>> (non-confidential) issue that's related to my work on CI, I ask them
to
>>>>> create a GitHub issue instead of a company internal ticket - I invite
>>>>> everybody to do the same.
>>>>> 
>>>>> MXNet is an open source project and moving away from company internal
>>>>> trackers towards community driven ones is the next logical step in my
>>>>> opinion. At the moment, everybody is working on their own and it's hard
>>>> to
>>>>> see for external people (or even developer who are not part of the same
>>>>> team) what we're actually working on.
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Marco
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 7:48 PM, Naveen Swamy <mnnaveen@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I am +1 for using JIRA. Managing bigger projects within MXNet on
JIRA
>>>>>> brings openness to the project. MXNet Users and the contributors
also
>>>> get
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> sense of where the project is heading.
>>>>>> Bigger Tasks can be divided into sub-tasks which contributors can
pick
>>>> up
>>>>>> small tasks based on their expertise on and contribute independently.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:40 AM, Chris Olivier <cjolivier01@gmail.com
>>> 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The vote was discussed on private@ before the vote on dev@, and
the
>>>>>> vote
>>>>>>> went on for a very long time.  There was ZERO resistance.   No
one
>>>>>> "snuck"
>>>>>>> it in or "slipped it by".
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> This, hopefully, phases out both SIM and tt, which are both are
being
>>>>>> used
>>>>>>> in ways that aren't what they're even designed for, IMO.  Trouble
>>>>>> tickets
>>>>>>> are being used as a backlog for my team, which is insane.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I've actually sent out a couple of mails on dev about contact
me if
>>>> you
>>>>>>> don't have access to JIRA.  If you would like to participate
in the
>>>>>>> direction of the project, please keep up with the dev email list.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I gave you contributor permissions on JIRA, btw.
>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:17 AM, Aaron Markham <
>>>>>> aaron.s.markham@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I'm not quite sure if I have enough background on reasons
for or
>>>>>> against
>>>>>>>> this to vote in the next round, but my two cents: I didn't
see much
>>>>>>> debate
>>>>>>>> on why we need yet another tool for issues that we have to
manually
>>>>>>>> maintain...the vote kind of slid in there without many stakeholders
>>>>>>>> realizing what they were being signed up for. I was thinking,
sure,
>>>> if
>>>>>>> YOU
>>>>>>>> want to make jira tickets, go right ahead. I have two internal
>>>>>> ticketing
>>>>>>>> systems to deal with already that assign tasks on MXNet,
plus
>>>> GitHub.
>>>>>>> Jira
>>>>>>>> would be four. Happy to make it work, but I'll need fifth
tool to
>>>>>>> aggregate
>>>>>>>> communications and metrics between the other four tools!
I'm only
>>>>>> sort of
>>>>>>>> joking.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I saw Chris's response, and ok the public visibility part
makes
>>>> sense,
>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>> does this phase out any other overhead? Does it integrate?
Jira has
>>>>>>>> integration options so maybe we can eliminate some overhead...
Like
>>>>>>>> something that hooks into the GitHub api and generates jira
tickets
>>>> on
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> fly... I want to believe there's a plan that makes this all
easier.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> What value I don't see is how we lower barriers to contribution
and
>>>>>> make
>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>> more fluid for new users that could become contributors.
What's the
>>>>>> story
>>>>>>>> and value proposition?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Also, I don't see any docs on the website or on github on
how to
>>>> sign
>>>>>> up
>>>>>>>> for jira, or how to contribute according to this new requirement
>>>>>> anywhere
>>>>>>>> on the site. Myself and new contributors wouldn't know what
the
>>>>>> expected
>>>>>>>> flow looks like because it's not really accessible. I now
see the
>>>>>>>> confluence wiki, but that's pretty much hidden from anyone
browsing
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> site or github and looking to contribute. Why is this info
on
>>>>>> confluence
>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>>> all? Why not in the docs on github that are rendered to the
website?
>>>>>> Or
>>>>>>>> conversely, why is some of the info on github and on the
website, if
>>>>>> it
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>> being maintained and current only on confluence?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> These are two separate issues really, but I think if you
want
>>>> buy-in,
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> needs to be more transparent and obvious, and provide clear
reasons
>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> benefits to why you're asking for more overhead.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Aaron
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Mar 6, 2018 21:14, "Eric Xie" <jxie@apache.org>
wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> -1
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> JIRA is ancient and arcane. This adds unnecessary overhead.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 2018/03/03 06:11:12, CodingCat <codingcat@apache.org>
wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> This vote passes with 6 +1 votes (6 bindings) and
no 0 or -1
>>>>>> votes.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Binding +1:
>>>>>>>>>> Chris Olivier
>>>>>>>>>> Indhu Bharathi
>>>>>>>>>> Suneel Marthi
>>>>>>>>>> Yuan Tang
>>>>>>>>>> Marco de Abreu
>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Schelter
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Vote thread:
>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.apache.org/list.html?dev@mxnet.apache.org:lte=
>>>>>>>>> 1M:tracking%20code%20changes%20with%20JIRA%20by%20associatin
>>>>>>>>> g%20pull%20requests
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I will continue with pushing the content to wiki
and take it
>>>> into
>>>>>>>>> practice
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>> 

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