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From Rodrigo Cano <>
Subject Re: [scala-debate] Emotional Support Group for Typesafe Maven Users
Date Wed, 03 Dec 2014 19:32:47 GMT
I just want to say that maven is not at all flowers, their phase model is
too primitive, to the point where something such as wsimport (pretty basic
stuff for good ol' java) did not work properly: I had a configuration for
the java version wanted in the pom.xml, but because of the way phases work
and the very restricted compile order, wsimport would always pick my
OS-globally configured wsimport instead of the one configured in the
pom.xml, leading to incorrect defintions of the ws and a VERY ugly hack
where I had to basically compile the thing twice to get it right. Also, my
os installed java was java7, the pom.xml stated that I wanted java6, guess
what version would the .class generated by wsimport be..

My point is, build tools are no easy task, and I know no system that does
it right. While my experience with sbt has certainly not been yours (and
I've done quite a bit with it, same with maven, where I had written several
plugins for our own dev environment), I do have to say that I find it an
improvement over maven.

I still love maven for what it accomplished though.


On Wed, Dec 3, 2014 at 5:11 PM, Eric Kolotyluk <>

>  Does anyone know of a good emotional support group for people trying to
> use Maven with Typesafe projects such as Akka and Play?
> I was thinking maybe there could a buddy/sponsor system, such as used in
> AA and other self help groups. Maybe there might be group sessions where
> people can talk about their trauma, especially by being constantly
> invalidated by comments such as "you should use the simple build tool SBT,
> cause, well you know, it's simple and easy to use."
> Seriously though, is there a community of people who are successfully
> using Maven with Akka an Play projects? I would love to meet you.
> I can see why people who have tried Maven naturally think "oh, its' too
> complicated, anyone can write a simple build tool that does what Maven
> does." Clearly they do not appreciate what Maven is or what it does. SBT
> and Gradle are two great examples of projects that attempted to do
> something more simple, but in the end, really don't measure up.
> I personally think the Scala community would be been better served if more
> investment was made in developing better Scala build tools within the Maven
> framework. More and better plugins for Scala, Akka, Play, etc.  Better use
> of
> I don't know if there is a Scala template for writing Maven plugins (or
> mojos), but there should be.
> The more I use SBT, the less I like it. It is not what I consider a
> serious build tool for build engineers, it is a toy or playground for Scala
> hackers who thrive on the abstruse. Don't get me wrong, I love Scala, but
> creating a build tool around .scala files just invites the use of chicken
> tracks and obscure overly concise cleverness that leads to one WTF
> experience after another. *It is actually possible to write Scala code
> that you can reason about,* but it just as easy to write Scala code that
> resembles APL, and reasoning about build engineering was clearly not a
> priority with the designers of SBT.
> The Scala-IDE was a really great approach because it leveraged off of an
> existing IDE infrastructure such as Eclipse, rather than trying to write an
> IDE from scratch the way SBT does. I wish the Scala/Typesafe community had
> taken the same approach with build-tools.
> - Eric
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