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From Chris Hostetter <hossman_luc...@fucit.org>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] TM in website graphic images
Date Fri, 28 Sep 2012 17:26:26 GMT

: 	Logos are important to recognize as trademarks as well.
: 	For the project's official logo (if it has one, and
: 	especially if it uses the ASF feather), ensure that it
: 	includes a small "TM" symbol in the graphic or
: 	immediately adjacent to it. For pages that include the
: 	poject logo on them, ensure you mention "... and the
: 	Project logo are trademarks..." in the attribution.

For me, the crux of the question/confusion is about the fact that 
according to these guidelines, all official logo's "especially if it uses 
the ASF feature" must include a small "TM" symbol....

Except that I can find no evidence anywhere on that this specific 
"requirement" has been adopted for the ASF feather itself...

	https://www.apache.org/
	https://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/
	http://www.apachecon.eu/

I can't find a single ASF page in which the ASF Logo includes an ugly "TM" 
-- instead, trademark notice related to the ASF logo seems to be dealt 
with on all apache.org pages (that i can find) in the same way that many 
companies seem to deal with this sort of thing w/o making their logo ugly: 
put a notice at the bottom...

"Apache and the Apache feather logo are trademarks of The Apache Software 
Foundation."

I see nothing wrong with putting "Apache Lucene and the Lucene logo are 
trademarks of The Apache Software Foundation." at the bottom of our pages.  
Likewise for Solr.  I don't udnerstand why the requirements say that 
project Logo's need "TM" in them when foundation logo doesn't.

: I propose that we take a VOTE, saying that we elect to ignore this 
: aspect of the branding requirements, so that we can close out the effort 
: to comply with the other aspects.
: 
: Here's the wording I'm thinking of:

I'm fine with holding a VOTE, but perhaps a better first step is to simply 
ask the branding team: "WTF is up with this requirement? We think it 
looks ugly, It doesn't seem to be legally require since many trademarked 
logos aren't displayed this way on their comany websites, and if it is 
required then why isn't the ASF Logo displayed this way?"

-Hoss

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